Quick Morality Question With Hypotheticals

[Seil]

Let's say (hypothetically) that I found a $20 bill on the round by the bus stop this morning. After I (hypothetically) picked it up, I had a (hypothetical) battle of my morality vs. my greed. I ended up (hypothetically) leaving it there, just in case the person who lost it came looking for it. (Hypothetically.)

Was I in the right to (hypothetically) not take this (hypothetical) money? The (hypothetical) people I've told this (hypothetical) story to say I should've taken it. Oh well.

I'm just hoping that whoever found it is happy with it.

Hypothetically.

[Kim]

I would have kept it unless I saw the person who dropped it. If I didn't take it someone else would, and chances are slim it'd be the person who lost it.

[Marc v4.0]

Let's say (hypothetically) that I found a $20 bill on the round by the bus stop this morning. After I (hypothetically) picked it up, I had a (hypothetical) battle of my morality vs. my greed. I ended up (hypothetically) leaving it there, just in case the person who lost it came looking for it. (Hypothetically.)

Was I in the right to (hypothetically) not take this (hypothetical) money? The (hypothetical) people I've told this (hypothetical) story to say I should've taken it. Oh well.

I'm just hoping that whoever found it is happy with it.

Hypothetically.

In Theory

[Amake]

If the person who dropped it finds it, they're going to assume they were very lucky no one saw it. If someone else finds it, they will think they're very lucky. You did the right thing, but chances are good it'll not put things right, and also no one will ever know it and no one will ever thank you. Funny how that works huh?

[Ecks]

Well, you're (hypothetically) out (hypothetically) free (hypothetical) money. Hypothetically.

[Mr.Bookworm]

I would have kept it, but then I am kind of a greedy asshole.

I mean, it's stealing. Just because someone leaves their shit lying around unsupervised in a public place doesn't make it unowned, unless you subscribe to the laws of a 5 year old playing finders keepers.

On the other hand, like Liz says, the person who dropped it almost certainly isn't going to try to find it, and you might as well snag it while you can.

On the other other hand, that's the completely bullshit excuse of someone trying to justify their actions. Just because a hypothetical someone else is a greedy asshole doesn't mean you should be a quicker greedy asshole.

So, basically, whatever you personally feel like doing. You can revel in your sense of moral superiority, even if you're $20 poorer than you could have been.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

I'd have taken it. Really, what're the chances the person who lost it is going to come back anytime soon and reclaim it? If you saw them drop it then sure let them know and hand it back, but otherwise, free money.

It's not like it's in a wallet or anything, which would of course be wrong to take, because they'd usually have id and such in and you could hand it in somewhere for the person to reclaim. But random loose money means the person probably just stuffed it into their pockets or something and then it slipped out, odds are they have no idea it's missing until much later and will never find it again because they have no idea where they lost it in the first place.

[Nique]

Take it and donate $20 to the charity of your choice. (Hypothetical) moral quandary solved!

[Meister]

With the authority of someone who until quite recently was really hurting for money, and whose girlfriend called him up one day shortly after leaving the house and said she was missing €50 from her wallet, and who then went out, traced her way to the train station and found that €50 on the ground, and for whom that made if not the difference between eating and not eating, then at least the difference between eating well and eating extremely basic in a not at all hypothetical way, I'd say you did good.

[Sifright]

It's also technically illegal in some countries to 'find' goods and you can actually be jailed.

[BitVyper]

In situations like this, always ask yourself; what would Ayn Rand do? Then do the opposite of that.

[Fifthfiend]

You should have left the 20 there with a note taped to it saying HEY PERSON WHO LEFT THIS 20 HERE YOU SHOULD PICK IT UP, PS IF THIS WASN'T YOUR 20 DOLLARS THEN DON'T TAKE IT, WHOEVER IT BELONGS TO PROBABLY NEEDS IT.

EDIT: Alternately, take the 20 dollars, then leave a note with your email address on it saying to contact you with a valid Paypal account that you can return it to.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Well if I saw them drop it, I'd probably give it back. However, people are getting on and off of buses all the time, so the owner could have very well already left, and its not like you can find them by saying "ANYONE LOSE $20?" So yeah, in that case I'd probably just take it.

[Krylo]

I mean, it's stealing. Just because someone leaves their shit lying around unsupervised in a public place doesn't make it unowned, unless you subscribe to the laws of a 5 year old playing finders keepers.
Actually that's pretty much exactly what it means. Leaving an object untended in a public place, except in very rare instances (like leaving a bike somewhere near where you dismounted to go wherever on foot for awhile), means that it is abandoned and, thus, no different than litter. You're basically picking up trash as far as any real moral, legal, or ethical quandaries go, unless you saw someone drop it.

I mean you don't go and drop a TV in the park and expect it to be there the next day. Either someone is going to think, "Hey, free TV!" and take it, or the park's janitorial crew is going to throw it out (or install it in the break room). Possession is nine tenths of the law and all that.

Plus, it's a paper bill. Chances are good it may not have even come from the bus stop, what with things like wind and all and bus stops generally being outside from what I know.

Though that doesn't mean you should just pick up anything you find and yell finder's keepers:

Well if I saw them drop it, I'd probably give it back. However, people are getting on and off of buses all the time, so the owner could have very well already left, and its not like you can find them by saying "ANYONE LOSE $20?" So yeah, in that case I'd probably just take it.

The proper way to do this is "Anyone lose some cash over here?" and then ask how much they lost. Chances are against someone saying they lost exactly twenty dollars unless they actually lost twenty dollars.

It's the kind of thing you learn if you ever go to a dealer's room in a con and have any kind of ethical foundation at all. If you find money, you pick it up, yell anyone lose their cash, and then if someone can tell you how much they lost (or describe the money clip or something) it's (probably) theirs. If they can't it's (probably) someone trying to con you, and if someone is pretty insistent it's theirs and they just can't remember the right amount you can use your gut to decide whether or not to trust them instead of just giving it to the first guy who says "yeah I lost X amount".

Speaking of: This is my basic rule for finding money anywhere. If no one claims it with any idea of how much it was it's my cash now and I don't have to worry about the person who lost it because the odds of it being what Meister described are so infinitesimally small that it's really not worth considering. Especially when you calculate in the chances of someone else finding it in the interim.

Though I do like Nique's solution, too. I try to give to the Salvation Army if I have extra income because I am intimately acquainted with the good that they do to poor people and so long as I'm not in that boat anymore it feels like I should try to pass it on. I haven't had extra income for awhile, though.

As for original topic: Man whatever. If it makes you happier to leave the money there you did the right thing. If you regret not taking it you did the wrong thing. Life is pretty simple like that, really.

Money and items are not equal to happiness, and you should really just do what makes you happy not what society expects of you. So long as you aren't hurting anyone else, at least.

Therefore: If you get more joy and less guilt out of knowing someone else had their day made by finding that twenty bucks (whether the original owner or someone else who needed or even just wanted the money) then you did the right thing. And trust me, whomever found that twenty dollars had their day made. That's pretty lucky and enough to make most people smile even if they don't REALLY need it.

[Azisien]

One time I was exitting the theater - I don't even recall the movie anymore, must have been great - and saw a $100 bill on the ground.

To my amazement, I reflexively looked to the small group of smokers closest to me and asked if it was theirs. They all shook their heads, one saying "I wish!"

Then I was $100 richer. My life was greater for it.

[Magus]

You should feel horrible, Seil. Any morally righteous person would have picked it up with tweezers and deposited it in a plastic baggie, kept it for the duration of their college degree in forensics, joined the FBI, and dedicated the rest of their life to tracking down the owner via fingerprints, fibers, and DNA.

People like you make me sick.

[Aerozord]

Its a bus, that or any other area of high traffic you should just take it. With the wind and movement of people it probably isn't even where the guy originally dropped it. Even if they did, its a bus, they would not only have to realize it was on a bus, worth going back for, but even remember the specific bus they were on.

That money will not get to its original owner, so its fair game. Now if it was like, say a classroom, or other location where a five second check would see if anyone was missing it then just ask for that. If no one in your general vicinity will claim it, chances are no one will.
One time I was exitting the theater - I don't even recall the movie anymore, must have been great - and saw a $100 bill on the ground.

To my amazement, I reflexively looked to the small group of smokers closest to me and asked if it was theirs. They all shook their heads, one saying "I wish!"

Then I was $100 richer. My life was greater for it.

the fact they didn't just lie and say it was theirs really gives me hope for humanity

[Doc ock rokc]

I kinda had a similar thing happen at a old job. Someone droped a small envolope with "funds" writen on the side and it had 50 bucks in it. I picked it up while cleaning and turned it into my manager. Turns out that no one claimed it by the end of the night and I got to keep it but still I would have liked for it to find it's home.

[Magus]

So Seil did you put a small stone on this bill to keep it from blowing away or do you enjoy being absolute scum?

[Seil]

Nah, I just left it there.

Hypothetically.

the difference between eating well and eating extremely basic

I thought you were all about the cakes? (nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=26039&)

So Seil did you put a small stone on this bill to keep it from blowing away or do you enjoy being absolute scum?

I listened to my inner-DFM (http://nuklearforums.com/showpost.php?p=743055&postcount=6)

means that it is abandoned and, thus, no different than litter.

It was pretty much exactly like this, only there wasn't anyone around. (http://art.penny-arcade.com/photos/215529374_ucnVU-XL-2.jpg)

[01d55]

Last week I was outside my office and I saw a $5 bill on the ground. Famously, economists say you never see a $5 bill on the ground because someone would pick it up. But instead of picking it up, I stood around watching to see if anyone else would. A bunch of people walked by not noticing it. Then one guy saw it, saw me, and asked if it was mine. I said no it wasn’t, I was just curious what would happen. He laughed and made a joke about economists. Then a second guy came by, picked it up, and said I’d dropped five dollars. I said no, actually it was there before me. He looked around, noticed a homeless guy across the street, said “I think he needs it more than me,” walked over and gave it to him.

From Yglesias (http://thinkprogress.org/yglesias/2011/10/13/342924/against-public-choice-for-public-virtue/).

I think the guy who resolved the situation here had the right idea: You don't know for sure that whoever lost the money really needs it, but you can easily find someone who really needs the money.

[Seil]

That makes me happy.