The craziness of the arguments is understandable. There is a lot of money involved. And it requires some education to comprehend the topics well.

Yuck, education.

Dude, Jimmy Carter had a handle on global warming in the fucking 70s. Nobody has an excuse.

Well, he also thought we'd be completely out of oil by like 1985, a year before I was born.

The point you raise is interesting though! Because between the 70s and now, the only thing that's occurred is the science and technology advancing, in some ways dramatically. This is good because we have a better handle of whats happening and bad because the more complex something is, the easier it is for skeptics to be like "ooooo that's not possible nyah nyah."


I should take this moment to mention that the skeptical perspective is sooo 17th century guys.

Well mostly the thing that happened between then and now was Ronald Reagan.

It really is sad to see any discussion where someone brings up the point of

"While I agree that limiting and cleaning up carbon emmisions is a step in the right direction, we need to do more research into accuratly rating the full impact of human-influenced global climate change before we start developing methods to reverse the effects of those emmisions as well. Our lack of oversight and education on this issue is what helped cause the problem we currently have and to run towards a dozen different climate-cooling methods at once would serve us no better. We need to consider and understand, to the very best of our abilities, the full impact these steps might have before we force them into being because we are in a hurry."

and they get laughed and jeered out for being a troll.

Seriously, what the fuck you guys?

Let's imagine we are having a discussion about sending a rocket ship to Mars and I say "Before we can do this we need to fully understand the implications of quantised gravity for without such knowledge our resources will not be fully optimised" I would be clearly trolling you.
Only replace a passive exploration trip with potential death of vast swathes of our population. I mean if its not trolling it's either ignorance or evilness.

Not to mention we already understand quite a lot.

Oh, so, to be concerned that if we rush into something without being sure the solution is controllable or correct and urge that we need to take the extra 2-3 years and do a little more homework on our solution methods, that is ignorant and evil? Can't be intelligent, can't be a smart move, careful, thoughtful, a rather good idea. Just Evil or Stupid.

Pretty much. To gain the full understanding you want would take decades and vast amounts of funding to rush it. By which time it would be too late.
We have methods right now which are incredibly viable and if we delay them even a few years we will be going over the tipping point. The production of CO2 is too vast that we need to cut back instantly-waiting will be too late. One can continue to research once the first measures are in place.
Also who is going to fund it? Nobody funds this research as it is. If you manage to find a magical source of money, it will be far more cost-effective to use it to lower emissions.We know how to do this- it is cheap, easy and fast. Research is slow, expensive and hard.
Besides our understanding is already very good- any research would only lead to a few percent increase in efficiency if that which would be vastly outweighed by the damage done in the intervening years.
So yes, it is evil or stupid.
It is not rational because it ignores the vast amount of evidence that we have that says urgency is essential in favor of "I hate change/the first people to die will be black people and who cares about them-amIrite?". It is also not rational even if you are all like "Money money money" because it is the opposite of cost-effective. When you are 90% efficient you should drop those measures in straight away, instead of spending more money and lots of polluting time,t trying to find that extra 10%.

Edit: Also you are rehasing the line that has been spun for the past 30 years that has got us into the shit we are in now- pretty much precisely because people were too scared shitless to call them trolls, to call them evil shits. To fix the planet at some point we just need to say "Shut up and fuck off" or this line will be used to prevent progress for the next 30 years. And by then the CO2 monster will eat us.

Lowering (and eliminating, ultimatly) our emmisions is seriosuly the best idea ever and needs to be done post haste.


Launching big disks into the sky or seeding extra clouds or doing any of the dozens of hair-brained schemes to activly lower the temp of the planet back down, to counteract the warming, is fucking stupid to do without extensive research into the long-term effects.

It isn't difficult to understand at all what I was saying, but you seem to want to paint my opinion as being "We shouldn't do anything at all, ever, until we spend another 8 decades researching".

It's the same way Ibian was treated, and he clearly said

but like hell I'm going to let it get twisted around on me.

We are all, hopefully, adults here. Can we have an actual debate where we don't blindly disregard reasonable concerns and opinions while either stuffing our ears and going "lalala" or completely misrepresenting and accusing people of shit they never said?


EDIT: Guess not

Lowering (and eliminating, ultimatly) our emmisions is seriosuly the best idea ever and needs to be done post haste.