But the real heros generally end up with some combination of Swords, Guns, AND Magic, either ending in some magitech monstrosity of doom, or some very impressive collaboration of awesome.

For example, Urza Planeswalker from MTG is an artificer who walks around in a mech with several magitech weapons. And he just happened to use it to destroy an entire plane of creatures because they pissed him off.

KOS-MOS from Xenosaga incorporates ether-magic, blasters, blades, scythes, what have you... All to great effect. However, this could be attributed that Killer Robots > Guns, Swords, and Magic. After all, Optimus Prime could squish Gandalf.

Squall from FF8 uses magic, and a gunblade, which just happens to be someone's idea of "Gun + Sword = WIN!"

Because why else would you put bayonets on rifles?

I think I read somewhere that the gun on Squall's gunblade wasn't used for long-ranged attacks. Instead, the resonation from firing the gunblade results in a more powerful strike:

Thus, I don't think one can say that Squall is "t3h ub4r m4g3k1774r" based on "OMG h3 h45 t3h gunb4d35 lolz" alone...

Not really. Spike had been shot in the stomach, and I believe in a few other places, had just gotten done fighting his way through an office building full of mafiates, and was basically on the verge of death when he went against Vicious, who was still fresh. In fact, he couldn't even see straight. Then he still killed Vicious, before succumbing to his wounds a few minutes later.

So half-dead gunman vrs fresh swordsman, and it comes out to a draw? Yeah, I'd say advantage guns.

I don't know enough about the other characters to know if you have any other fallacies in there... but I felt the need to point that out.

Otherwise I'm kinda with the general consensus, which is that in a world that incorporates both magic and guns, you'll probably end up with both of them coming to a head.

Although magic guns > magic swords.

I agree. You know what they say: Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

Just go play Gunz online and find out who kills who with what...

http://www.gunzonline.com/

Well, true. However, the weapon still incorporates Gun-ness with Sword-ness, which is what I was attempting to argue without the use of leetspeek. However, it remains that he uses all three.

Juji's (Gungrave: Overdose) Gunblades>Squall's Gunblade. They were actually blades that had guns on the hilts. They shot bullets at guys and everything, and then Juji'd slice up whatever frackjob was around him.

In a fantasy setting, where creatures exist that can take a full clip and keep on trucking, guns don't always spell instant death for what they shoot. Do guns kill things like, say, Sin from FFX? Could a gun kill ANY of the things in DMC or Gungrave in a single bullet, like they do in real life.

A gun isn't nearly as useful if it can't kill in one hit. Especially if we're talking a fucking Behemoth charging at you at top speed, trying to crush your tiny body to a bloody goo.

What you people are forgetting is one major thing. How the magic is used/learned. Are you dancing around a circle? are you chanting a phrase? are you making arcane hand symbols? using a magic device? some combination of the above? or do you think a thought and MAGIC! if it's not the last one magic loses. Becasue If I have time to run up and cut you/bust you in the head. Your years of magic training don't mean shit. This is not to say that you might not have cast a bullet/blade deflecting spell before our encounter. But that's the same as the sniper or Ninja head stab attack, it's stacking the deck. you want to know where this discussion really would be proven? in the world of my favorite RPG that I don't own and did'nt get to finish, Skies of Arcadia. If you recall, how was magic done? say a word, make shit happen. How was magic learned? Kill shit with your weapon, with the right stone in it. Eventually you learn magic.then you use it with your weapon. skies of arcadia, beyond just rocking for being so happy and cool, had the weirdest magic system ever.

"Ohh great sage, I want to learn thunder magic."
sage: Here's a spear, kid. Go stab all your enemies, if you haven't learned how to shoot lightning from your hands by then, screw it cause you don't have anybody to shoot it at.

Sin was only defeated because of guns on the airship, remember. They blasted massive holes in him that allowed the party to attack.

As for DMC--DMCIII's Heaven or Hell mode. Everything dies to a single hit. Probably the hardest difficulty setting, unless you're using Ebony and Ivory. In which case it probably ranks around Dante Must Die, just because a single half-mistake kills your ass.

And even outside of that, there were very powerful guns in DMC1 and 3. The rocket launcher in 3, for instance, was capable of killing entire groups of minor enemies in a single shot, and Ebony and Ivory were still massively useful against some bosses--just slower than swords, as was the rifle.

Spell casting times vary. Maybe some of the more uber spells can't be cast before you get to me, but even in the slowest systems I can get one or two off to slow you down/maim you/whatever.

Definately wouldn't get off one before you shot me though. Unless its a really fast one used while you were aiming.

Also: In some worlds, a mage not having wards is like a normal person not wearing clothes. They put them up before they ever go anywhere. I do agree that its stacking the deck in most though. Really though, the wards give a mage a chance agianst even a sniper, so we could stack them if you'd like.

Well, actually, if there's a Behemoth charging at me at [rest here], I'm probably gonna want to be as far away as possible. So, yeah, they're still useful. And surely anyone going up agianst that Behemoth learned how to dodge, or run away at some point. You can shoot and run at the same time.