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-   -   Increasing difficulty in visiting America makes people want to stop visiting America. (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=16309)

Fifthfiend 11-25-2006 06:46 PM

Increasing difficulty in visiting America makes people want to stop visiting America.
 
No I mean, who would have guessed?

US is 'worst' in welcoming foreign visitors: survey

Quote:

The United States ranks worst in welcoming foreign business travelers and tourists, due to bureaucratic headaches and rude immigration officials, a survey showed.

...

The survey found that two-thirds of travelers surveyed feared they would be detained at the border because of a simple mistake or misstatement.

"Foreign travelers are in agreement: the US entry process is unpredictable and unfriendly to foreign visitors, it is hurting America's image abroad and deterring many from visiting the US," said Thomas Riehle, partner, RT Strategies, which conducted the poll.

"These survey results help to explain the 17 percent decline in overseas travel to the US over the past five years and the 10 percent decline in business travel to the US over the past year."
More on the same.

It turns out, when you do things like this to people trying to visit America, well... people stop visiting America.

It just seems like there would be some means of protecting ourselves from the terrorists that doesn't involve cutting ourselves off from the rest of the world.

notasfatasmike 11-25-2006 06:59 PM

Quote:

Dennis Roddy wrote in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette: "Our enemies are now more important to us than our friends ... Much of the obsession with homeland security seems to turn on the idea of the world infecting the US."
Quoted for accuracy. That whole article is pretty disgusting. Is it bad that I'm so used to stories like this that I can't even bother to be outraged anymore? If I spent all my time getting as mad as I should at the complete idiocy that seems to have infected my home country, I'd never have time to get anything done but feel rage.

Fifthfiend 11-25-2006 10:42 PM

All right guys, that's enough of that. Roy made a joke where it was easy enough to take it seriously, ILS took it seriously, and let's just wrap it up there.

Krylo 11-26-2006 02:18 AM

Ok, guys, seriously, enough. It is only my good mood that is keeping me from issuing warnings already *coughbellsouthcough*. This is not an off-topic thread. This is not even a general thread. This is a discussion thread. If all you have to say is some half-baked wise-ass comment, that, honestly isn't even funny *coughroy&bellsouthcough*, don't say anything at all.

Edit: Actually, I'm just going to delete all the spam posts, and posts that were directly replying to them, except Fifth's, cause his orders still stand, to avoid more people replying to them, as well as streamlining the thread.

Mesden 11-26-2006 02:40 AM

Come on. I mean, Franklin said it best:

"Those who would trade freedom for security deserve neither"

It's a terrible paranoia that's swept America, and now all we can do is sit on our hands until this sympathy based ride to more governmental power(The nice, happy oppressive kind) ends.

Let's just hope the new Congress doesn't soil themselves.

POS Industries 11-26-2006 03:08 AM

What really amazes me is the intricate detail involved in the total disregard for habeas corpus here. I mean, not only must foreign journalists obtain a special visa to enter the United States, but they must do so without any warning and make sure not to sign the required waiver that states in fine print that you are, in fact, not a journalist. And just what happens if you don't sign that form, hmm?

So, let's see: We're no longer the "Land of the Free" because we stopped being the "Home of the Brave". What's left?

Mirai Gen 11-26-2006 04:11 AM

What's even more unbelivable is our willingness to spread our influence, then shut off other countries influencing us.

Its really one-sided and hypocritical, but that sounds like the US in a nutshell anyway.
Quote:

It just seems like there would be some means of protecting ourselves from the terrorists that doesn't involve cutting ourselves off from the rest of the world.
Which actually brings me to my next question: is this Bush Administration related, or is this just part of the same "woo, look out or the terrorists will get you!" surge that's hit ever since 9/11?
Quote:

Earlier this year, Condoleezza Rice, US secretary of state, and Michael Chertoff, homeland security secretary, promised to tackle these concerns and improve the visa process, which in many countries can take months and cost hundreds of dollars.
Well, it looks like it's not being completely overlooked. Cross our fingers.

Deck Knight 11-26-2006 08:19 PM

Who cares. Nobody is pounding on the door to get in to Europe, and quite frankly if America is so bad, why do we have such a massive illegal immigration problem our idiot president (on this issue) does not want to solve?

Quite frankly I'll start caring about world opinion when the world decides to take responsibility for the world's problems instead of waiting for the US to act, lambasting us if we fail, or taking the glory if we succeed. NOBODY likes airport security, but business travelers who have experience are smart enough not to get tied up by security.

Boo-freaking-hoo. An isolated incident where someone gets turned away. Big deal. It isn't security's job to be a friendly smile at the door, it is their job to protect America from terrorists and other unwelcome elements.

Mesden 11-26-2006 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deck Knight
Who cares. Nobody is pounding on the door to get in to Europe, and quite frankly if America is so bad, why do we have such a massive illegal immigration problem our idiot president (on this issue) does not want to solve?

Quite frankly I'll start caring about world opinion when the world decides to take responsibility for the world's problems instead of waiting for the US to act, lambasting us if we fail, or taking the glory if we succeed. NOBODY likes airport security, but business travelers who have experience are smart enough not to get tied up by security.

Boo-freaking-hoo. An isolated incident where someone gets turned away. Big deal. It isn't security's job to be a friendly smile at the door, it is their job to protect America from terrorists and other unwelcome elements.

Yes, it's entirely the security's job to strip away habeus corpus from the Constitution and subject people to terrible treatment.

Wait, no, I stuttered.

It's not security's job to take away constitutional rights.

Fifthfiend 11-26-2006 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deck Knight
Who cares. Nobody is pounding on the door to get in to Europe, and quite frankly if America is so bad, why do we have such a massive illegal immigration problem our idiot president (on this issue) does not want to solve?

Quite frankly I'll start caring about world opinion when the world decides to take responsibility for the world's problems instead of waiting for the US to act, lambasting us if we fail, or taking the glory if we succeed. NOBODY likes airport security, but business travelers who have experience are smart enough not to get tied up by security.

Boo-freaking-hoo. An isolated incident where someone gets turned away. Big deal. It isn't security's job to be a friendly smile at the door, it is their job to protect America from terrorists and other unwelcome elements.

Well I mean, I did provide the one example for illustrative purposes, but that international travel has dropped off in such a manner, and for the reasons cited in polling, would indicate that this is more than just an isolated issue.

And of course the issue of people entering the country illegally is at some remove from the treatment of businesspeople and tourists trying to legally conduct their affairs within our borders. It's less about anything so remote and airy as 'world opinion' and more about the concrete impact of that opinion on our national well-being. Whatever anyone's opinion of foreigners in general, that they would be so increasingly reluctant to conduct their business here seems like it could hardly be to anything but our economic and political detriment.


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