The Warring States of NPF

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-   -   To what extent ARE people assholes, really? (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=19471)

Demetrius 04-16-2007 06:53 PM

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I suspect that's more a matter of what you happen to be seeing catching up with what actually is.
That is true to some extent. There are several frames of reference that spring to mind, one being how people treat each other while driving, people don't care about others, I used to spend a significant amount of time on the road for work without many issues, now however in the same areas I have been nearly run off the road, hit, cut off, high beamed etc, more in the last few years than at all before that. People care about what they are doing, not how it affects others. In a less direct example, I have spent most of my working days with people around my parents' age, they have a work ethic, look out for each other and are generally good people (bad apples have been mixed in of course), whereas the younger people now beginning to mix into the work force are nearly the polar opposite, they are out for themselves and will throw their best friend under the buss for a promotion.

An even better example is this:
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Heh sorry that was meant to Mannix. I just have this tendacy to avoid the quote button. You can ignore it if you like. It has no real purpose to you.
This is a discussion forum, you are meant to respond in a manner pertaining to the topic on hand and in such a way that it deals with the other people reading this thread.

Overcast 04-16-2007 07:07 PM

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Originally Posted by Demetrius
This is a discussion forum, you are meant to respond in a manner pertaining to the topic on hand and in such a way that it deals with the other people reading this thread.

And I did to begin with. Then I posted again in response to someone. Then Mannix responded to that so it seemed right I respond back. I apologize if it annoyed you in any way, but I have no way of taking it back as of now since it already has been read by you.

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Originally Posted by fifthfiend
Yeeeeah here's a news flash? You don't get to dictate how people here think. This thing you have going on about insinuating how because this is a sprite comics forum it means people aren't allowed to be intelligent, or whatever you're on about, is really getting obnoxious. If you can't be bothered to respect this forum and its community then you're entirely welcome to get the fuck off of it.

I'm sorry once more. I really didn't mean anything by it. I'll try take this in a form of stride to know better if that was the goal of the moderation since I haven't been banned yet (though I am not leaving that out as if it won't happen) but before I strike off any more I'll just leave this thread in particular.

Mannix 04-17-2007 12:20 AM

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Originally Posted by Overcast
And I did to begin with. Then I posted again in response to someone. Then Mannix responded to that so it seemed right I respond back. I apologize if it annoyed you in any way, but I have no way of taking it back as of now since it already has been read by you.


I'm sorry once more. I really didn't mean anything by it. I'll try take this in a form of stride to know better if that was the goal of the moderation since I haven't been banned yet (though I am not leaving that out as if it won't happen) but before I strike off any more I'll just leave this thread in particular.

Try not to worry about it too much, kid. They're basically doing exactly what I'm talking about - teaching/moulding through example. Youngsters can't know what's right if nobody tells them any better. Action now is what's required.

Also, I didn't mean for my post to sound racist. What I do when I make a post is lay out the framework, then flesh it out. My ride to work rang the doorbell before I could finish so I just hit post. Brittney Spears, "KFed," and Paris Hilton are the kind of people that should live and die in obscurity.

On topic, there's a documentary maker by the name of Adam Curtis that works for the BBC that has explored this theme extensively. Essentially, the development of Consumerism and Cold War strategic theory simplified our view of humanity and the world around us. It's hard for me to sumarize about 10 hours of film in a paragraph, but essentially people are (in this view) automotons incapable of nuance or self-control/personal responsibility. People only act for their own personal interest and indeed should be incouraged to do so because denying one's nature is dangerous and leads to all sorts of societal problems (murder, rape, riot, economic collapse, etc).

His discussion of how this applies to politics is semi off-topic and is a great deal more typing for myself. Having seen all 3 of his major films though I can tell you the Wikipedia entries are fairly accurate and provide a decent summarization. If you don't want to sit through that much film (which are all fascinating as hell, btw) just read them. Highly thought provoking.

Here They Are.

ZAKtheGeek 04-18-2007 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mannix
It's hard for me to sumarize about 10 hours of film in a paragraph, but essentially people are (in this view) automotons incapable of nuance or self-control/personal responsibility. People only act for their own personal interest and indeed should be incouraged to do so because denying one's nature is dangerous and leads to all sorts of societal problems (murder, rape, riot, economic collapse, etc).

And this view, as I gather from the Wiki, is extremely far from trustworthy. It was basically developed by a paranoid man, and its models only predicted anything correct when people agreed beforehand to behave as selfishly as possible, or when the people were economists or psychopaths (most amusing, I must say).

There are a number of suggestions that people are being engineered to act this way (because it's so predictable, I guess), which does aid the idea that people aren't really that selfish without this societal influence, although it doesn't necessarily prove it.

Mannix 04-19-2007 04:19 AM

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Originally Posted by ZAKtheGeek
And this view, as I gather from the Wiki, is extremely far from trustworthy. It was basically developed by a paranoid man, and its models only predicted anything correct when people agreed beforehand to behave as selfishly as possible, or when the people were economists or psychopaths (most amusing, I must say).

There are a number of suggestions that people are being engineered to act this way (because it's so predictable, I guess), which does aid the idea that people aren't really that selfish without this societal influence, although it doesn't necessarily prove it.

John Nash (the guy from A Beautiful Mind) was/is a paranoid schizophrenic and has, in his later years, recanted the idea as naively simplistic. It's probably the single most influential idea of the last century, unfortunately, as it's been applied to all sorts of things even Nash didn't envision - economics and marketing being the two chief examples.

I'll say it again though, everybody should at least take a cursory glance at these things. Even if you think it's all horse shit, it at least provides a well reasoned point of view that isn't much discussed in the mainstream these days.


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