Global warming is a fact, Aerozord. There's scientific measurements showing an increase annualy of the average temp or some crap.

The real debate is whether or not Global Warming is something that is supposed to be happening, or is something humans are forcing, and subsequently should be stopped/countered.

Why isn't that mute though? I mean, polluting is bad, shouldn't we stop producing green house gasses anyways?

Yeah, if it were that simple we would have done it years ago.

What you are asking is that we drop everything and revert back to the stone age. Which not everyone is willing to do. The problem is infinitely more complicated than just stopping. New technology is being developed every day, and scientists are always nearing a solution to every problem. Until then, it is up to us to determine how much pollution the world can take, and act accordingly. This is the favored alternative, waiting. Waiting for the powers that bind to make everything all better, so we dont have to give up the things we like. Even though life will get incrementially more expensive forcing out the middle class and resulting in the Elitist caste ruling 90% of the world.

But lets not worry about that, lets just solve global warming.

Because:
1) The planet adjusts to changes, whether it be human caused or natural.
2) People are accustomed to the way they live. removing green house gasses will cause a significant change in certain areas...

No I am not saying we stop eveything, but we should be working to eliminate them reguardless.

But as I said before, its simple cause and effect. We are producing gasses that cause the greenhouse effect, ie gasses that make the tempurature rise. The tempurature is rising, hmm I wonder why tempuratures are rising, DUH. To again use an anology, wondering if human pollution is causing global warming is like shooting someone one and wondering if you killed them. Yea there is a slim chance something else happened to kill them at the same time, but that doesn't change the fact it was most likely you.

Also, yes the planet will adjust, thing is what will that adjustment mean for humanity? Most likely massive death, of course this would solve the over population issue talked about on the other thread. But I personally preffer to avoid the scenario that involves extensive global death.

Humans adjust almost easier than the planet does. Unless if something extreme happens(The atmosphere becoming toxic, water vanishing, the average temperature skyrocketing up to 150 a day) sometime soon we'll survive.

It's mostly the rest of the environment that won't survive, as they lack adaptability.

it is true besides single celled organisms there is nothing harder to kill then humans.

But unlike most humans, I care about all life, not just my own species. But at the same time I accept that death and extinction is natural. My concern is if all of our unnatural tampering with the ecosystem is the cause. And only an idiot wouldn't realize that we are doing something. I mean do you really think mining, burning fossil fuels, and moving species to entirely new continents is natural?

If you care about all life then does that mean you don't swat flies/fleas/etc?
You avoid eating anything that isn't made from something that has never lived(which is, of course, nothing at all beyond water)?


What is natural and what isn't? You seem to be of the belief that burning fossil fuels is unnatural, yet fossil fuels are burned by nature itself purely on accident, and the result isn't something that is rewarding in any fashion but rather destructive. Moving of species occurs naturally, continents move about, animals migrate, et cetera. Mining is something animals do often, ants for instance will create massive sprawling mineshafts that in size-comparison simply dwarfs anything Humans have done thus far.

I think he's saying that he's willing to swat flies, because that happens all the time with animals, even without human interference, but he isn't willing to dump pesticide all over their habitat.

Yes, I refuse to kill an insect without just cause. I capture flies and spiders and as a rule release them outside. I wont kill something just because it annoys me. Especially when I could remove them with just a minor inconvience to myself. No reason to kill them

As I also said, I accept death as part of nature. I will kill to sustain life just like any other animal. To kill something and not devour it is to defile its life, making its death meaningless. I follow the belief that the animals death is a noble sacrifice to allow other creatures to live. I will kill to defend myself and others, I will kill to feed myself and others. Life breeds death, thats just how things are. This of course works both ways, say a lion kills and eats a human, well it has to eat too.
fossil fuels dont normally burn since they are hundreds or even thousands of feet underground. And we aren't talking about the occasional burning of it, we are talking about burning billions of gallons a year.

Moving animals does happen, over millenia, not months.

and I dont think comparing an anthill compares to making mountains disappear.