Wii Controls and their uses
 

Just wanted to back the hell up for a moment here to say this before we continued discussionifying:

Okay lemme correct myself here - the 360 is the most popular system between the 360 and the PS3. The Wii doesn't do graphics like the other two do, and therefore Sony more or less had no choice. Under the parameters of the Wii just not being able to handle the new Final Fantasy I didn't even think about it, and when I said "flat-out most popular system" I just meant the PS3 and 360.

In other words:
That. My mind just filed it out as a candidate since development for it was started long before they ever announced a console.

Moving on to Wii controls: The problem with the Wii so far is that all the motion-sensor has done is basically forced developers to make games that are flat out awful with the sensor as a gimmick or, worse yet, just not handle the controls like they should. Twilight Princess is a great example - the motion tracker was very tacked on, especially compared to games like No More Heroes.

A good relief that's been coming around lately is making games compatible with Gamecube and the Classic Controller, because the Wii can be exhausting to the point where you don't want to buy games for it anymore because it's work.

I'm curious as to what exactly you don't like. I won't deny that it's very flat and doesn't fit well in the hands but it's like a Super NES controller with thumbsticks, it isn't awful.

It's not awful for, say, VC. What I don't like is that I can't see myself using it to play a game like a Final Fantasy, where I'm sitting and holding it for god knows how many hours in a given session. Eventually the conversation moved on but originally I was talking about how I'd like to see a Wii controller that fits the "normal" quo, like the 360 or PS3 controller. To elaborate, I'm talking about one that I can sit there for two or three hours and play an RPG with, which I don't think I'll ever do with my VC short of the occasional Ocarina of Time playthrough.

Plus I don't like the triggers. Maybe it's because I'm one of those people who likes to pop console triggers with his middle finger and not the index, but for some reason it never feels right.

Anyone willing to trade your PS3 for my Wii, im game. Hell, i'll even pay for both international shipping fees.

I wanted a PS3 (still do) but i cant afford it. and i won a Wii, so that was good... but the games ARE tiredsome, too short or really close to shovelware...

I keep saying it because it is true... Shadow of the colossus, God of war, FInal Fantasy XII, DIsgaea, Soul Calibur 3, Metal Gear solid... those are all games that the Wii, not only can handle, but it probably can improve over a bit.

Zelda came, and it was good, because it was "Zelda". It's not a very good game on it's own rights. Mario Galaxy came, and it's fun, cute, nice.... but c'mon, is that game on your top 10 wii games? Do you HAVE 10 games on your top 10 wii games? Smash bros is something everybody play, because, c'mon... you guys are suckers for online/offline competions and rule testing matchs...

The problem is that, as time passes it just gets more clear that the Wii is a great console with a gimmick added as a main feature (it is a gimmick... not a revolution) but nobody takes it very serisouly (yet) and Nintendo is trying to be all cool like "Dude... dont worry, i got this...!" so, all kinds of 5-10 hours gaming crap with the quality of the first and second PS2 years keeping coming out.

I like my wii, i really do. But i dont see it alive in 2010. Im not even sure if it will be around after Little big planet, home, Avatars, Gears of War 2, Killzone 2, spore and FF13 come around...

I bet you could get someone to do that too. They are in extremely high deman over here.

Exception: Metroid Prime 3, which has the best controls of any game I've ever played.

The thing about the Wii is that hate it or love it, I like what it's attempting. It eschewed just creating awesome graphics in order to try something a bit different. And I applaud them for that. Sure it may not be brilliant but I like the thinking behind it.

That, to be honest, sounds a lot like what people were saying about the DS back in 2004 and 2005.

My suggestion: give it time. Developers are still acclimatising themselves to the different input method. Those who care will eventually get it right, and the WiiMotion plus seems to be the excellent push for it.

Either I have baby hands or you guys are Goliaths, but goddammit I simply cannot find a fault in the Classic Controller's size.

Also, I have to say the flatness of the Classic Controller is part of the charm. As someone who was raised up by the SNES I'm glad that the back of the controller doesn't have any elevations to make it feel more ergonomically correct. It really goes well towards attaining that old-school feeling of the Virtual Console.

I played Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy VI on the SNES. I cannot fathom how the Classic Controller could feel like a hindrance when playing an RPG. Unless it goes to the size issue again.

Now, if we are talking about the Wiimote plus Nunchuk combination then it's even more difficult for me to understand. I like having both of my hands free and being able to use them individually. I don't have to hold a fixed position for hours thanks to that.

I guess all this shows is that the craftmanship of video game controllers is an art of the most subjective of tastes.

That's more reasonable and I can see your point.

May I ask, what games do you have? Because it sounds like you are not really looking for all of the good games.

And Super Mario Galaxy is my favourite game of the generation. Possibly my favourite console game since Ocarina of Time.

Oh I'm not damning the Wii to mediocrity or anything. I'm just saying it's going to take some time before developers start to realize how they can utilize the motion tracker. Just like the DS.

This stuff is all new so developers need some time and tinkering to figure out how to make it fun and not "wave the Wiimote like a dweeb cause it's fun."

I'm still not seeing why it's just apparently ruled out as a possibility in this discussion that a game can be played with the wiimote/nunchuck combo and not have motion sensor features involved. I even provided a diagram around it being used for a FF-style game:

http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o...ies/FF_wii.jpg
(NOTE: "Run" here means "escape from battle," you mooks.)

There is nothing there about motion sensor. And, frankly, as a standard controller, this setup really is quite nice. As I said before, very comfortable and intuitive. Especially comfortable, much moreso than the GC, PS2/3, or XBox controllers. I really enjoy not having to have both hands glued to one spot to play, for instance. Granted, it doesn't afford the player as many easily accessible buttons, but those commands can be bound to motion sensor directions, as No More Heroes proved. This may have surpassed the SNES controller as my favorite ever, only by virtue of the fact that you have the option to just flat-out plug a SNES controller with analog sticks into it.

But yeah, like RT said, it's likely that developers will stop eventually ham-fistedly making the waggle gimmick necessary in every Wii game they make, just as the stylus is necessary in a lot of DS games anymore. Hell, even Nintendo realizes that they don't have to do that in their own games (Hiya Brawl!)

As far as controllers go? Nothing wrong with a Final Fantasy on the Wii. Sans the fact that it's two separate pieces, the Wii Nunchuks actually works nicely as a normal controller.

I just don't think they'd be able to restrain themselves graphically or longevity-wise enough to have it fit on a Wii disc or run on the Wii's hardware.

Right now, anyway. If they made an FF from the ground up for the Wii it'd be great.

I guess I should have noted that it wasn't a reason why a FF game would be playable on the Wii as much as that was just using an FF-style setup as an example due to the thread in which it originated, because Cid Highwind for some reason seemed to think that to play a game on the Wii without motion sensors you have to unplug the nunchuck, turn the wiimote on its side, and play it NES style.

EDIT: Though it could be argued that, since I only mentioned at the beginning that I was using a FF-style control scheme as an example and then never mentioned the series at all afterward, that the post itself had nothing to do with putting a FF game on the Wii, but whatever.

DOUBLE EDIT: But I just had "FF" all over this post and so now there's a good chance that it's the only thing anybody's going to see here and I'll get yet another rebuttal against my laughable idea for a Wii FF game that someone thinks I'm arguing for rather than them actually reading my post, so I give up.