The Old Republic
 

A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away...

Fanboys of the game known as Knights of the Old Republic awaited the sequel to one of the most amazing RPG experiences they've ever had, in what would be come known as the greatest Star Wars game ever.

Alas, Knights of the Old Republic II, developed by Obsidian rather than the almighty Bioware, seemed a slight step sideways from the original. While it had improved gameplay, the storyline which put Knights of the Old Republic on a level playing field with the original Star Wars was non-existent.

Now, after having done secret work for several years, Bioware and Lucasarts have unveiled their masterplan:

Star Wars: The Old Republic

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6199726...opslot;thumb;1

Will it be the World of Warcraft slayer the World of Warcraft haters such as myself have longed for? Will it be the ultimate MMOG experience? Will its gameplay and storyline meet the standards set by Knights of the Old Republic? Will it blow Star Wars Galaxies out of the water?

Stay tuned...

It will be horrible just like every other MMO.

I'd be inclined to agree (City of Heroes notwithstanding) except I've been a huge fan of every Bioware game ever made. I put an extra effort into playing (even buying) games with the Bioware tag on it because I know I'm going to be entertained.

Of course, Bioware hasn't made an MMO yet... but if they do as well as they do with everything else then it might have a shot of being actually amazing.

This pretty much sums up my opinion on this, and every other thread like this.

If you ask me, they should have just gotten off their asses and made KOTOR:3.

Come on, Bioware, I've beaten Mass Effect three times already! Make me another good single-player RPG, dammit!

Yeah, I'm about twenty times more excited for KOTOR3, personally.
Also, I'm personally of the opinion that KOTOR2's story will be even better then KOTOR's once Team Gizka gets off their asses and finishes their long-awaited mod. There was this "KOTOR2 Let's Play" thread I read through once and I was blown away at how awesome Obsidian intended KOTOR2's story to be.

You do realize there isn't going to be a KOTOR3, right?

Or rather, this IS KOTOR3...

Translation: We decided to do this MMO instead of a real single-player KOTOR3 because the MMO will make us lots more money.
Despite the release of phenomenal games like Portal and Braid, I can't escape the feeling that the videogaming industry is falling apart lately.

PC Gaming is dead and its lifeless corpse is animated by MMO's and ValueSoft

So long as I'm still enjoying the crap out of my Total War games, PC gaming isn't quite dead. Dying, yes, but not quite dead.

PC gaming will not die until they manage to put RTS games on consoles without having them suck hard.

And honestly, I could not give a fuck about every MMO that comes out every 5 seconds. IF I ever play another MMO... and that's a pretty big IF... then it'll be the Warhammer 40k one. And I'll probably give that up within a few months anyway.

Yeah, MMOs? Not my thing. I mean, what can you do with them that World of Warcraft and Age of Reckoning haven't already done? Not counting "abandon the bullshit monthly payment."

jesus fuck no goddamn. I dont want to have to grind 70 levels just to figure out what the fuck happened after KoToR 2, this fucking project needs to die

Well, judging by this thread, it seems that I cannot wait for this game. Will I play it? I dunno, maybe. But I'm getting a good laugh so far.

I'm sorry I couldn't here you over the remote possibility of being able to have Profession: Lightsaber Crafting.

Profession: Lightsaber Crafting doesn't do you a whole lot of good if it only allows you to build your own lightsaber over and over again for yourself, which is what Jedi can do according to lore.

Oh man, a Bioware MMO? Half the content is gonna be missing... Their going to make you pay for an expansion pack just to get that half that the game is missing. And we can't trust lucas arts, they did ditch bioware for KOTOR2 afterall. I don't think they can be forgiven for that mistake.

It got handed off to Obsidian, who works with Bioware fairly frequently. Not "ditched". Obsidian also took Neverwinter Nights 2, it's not a Lucas Arts-related issue.

I'll probably try to swindle my way into the beta for this and then make my decision. On one hand I hate MMO's (Guild Wars aside) and on the other I love both Star Wars and Bioware.

Which Bioware game is this referring to? Every single Bioware game I've ever played has been astoundingly good. If you've had a bad experience I'd be interested in hearing about it.

I mean, look at their game list:

MDK2, Baldur's Gate series (best game evah), Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Knights of the Old Republic, Mass Effect...

I've loved every single one of them. BGII and KOTOR are two of my three favorite all time games. If anybody can sell me on a MMOG, its going to be a company that has sold me on every single one of their games thus far....

Jade Empire, Mass Effect, both could've been longer. But the prospect of obsidian handling an MMO worries me more.

My problem with Baldur's Gate was that right around the halfway point of any given game you realized you were just doing the same shit over and over again, whereas with KotOR, it managed to fool me until the last of the four map planets. And then it was still fun.

However, I did like running the gauntlet with Drizz't.

I'd rather see Jade Empire expanded upon.

Jade Empire I'd like to see expanded as well, but I have no problems with Mass Effect at the length it is. And that's without Bringing Down The Sky...ME isn't some Oblivion-length sandbox game, and they had to cut it off somewhere for ME2.

Well ME just felt longer, there weren't enough quests to keep me satisfied. I agree about Jade Empire however.

I'm a huge fan of the Old Republic and I like MMOs generally (Despite being tired of the Everquest clone syndrome) so count me in.

I'm excited.

Can't they just make a normal RPG with a single player storyline?

I dislike MMO's. A lot.

I am extremely dissapointed, once again!

Also, I liked KOTOR II better than I did the first one. Except the ending though, that was kind of lame.

Here's hoping that in a few months there'll be another announcement saying that Obsidian is working on kotor 3.

As for the Old Republic itself, I'll reserve judgement until there are more details about class/level systems, character customization, and subscription fees before I decide to be excited or disappointed.

It was totally existent, it just wasn't in the actual game. =( =(

It was even a better story, I promise! You just kind of have to find everything yourself and stuff. =\

To be fair, the scripting was actually better in my opinion. They just forgot to have it mean anything.
If they don't make force lightning the best move in the game somehow, they botched the coding and balancing.

Well KOTOR2 got rushed IMO, so in all fairness, it's not really obsidian's fault. If lucas arts gave them enough time, they could've finished it with plenty of time to spare. I did think the ending was rather lame though and some parts just could've been expanded upon.

I'm not sure who's fault it is but they rushed it to get the christmas sales, which is why I quit playing it halfway through and instead I'm just going to wait for Team Gizka to finish their fix.

'Twas LucasArts' fault on that one, actually.

Just about the only hope I hold for this game is for some genius at Bioware to steal the idea I had about an MMO where you control an entire customizable party of characters. Basically you take the party structure of a traditional one player RPG ala KOTOR 1/2 mix in some squad based stuff from Republic Commando and you use that as the basis of your MMO. Except you let the player customize the look of their companions.

It can even be worked into the level up system so that you start alone for the first 10 levels. Then you pick up a friend. After 20 or 30 more levels you pick up a 3rd friend and become a 3 person party. Then after that you start picking up spare party members so you can mix and match for the situation at hand. Obviously your main character would be a Jedi and your friends would probably be mostly non-jedi with the option to go jedi but at a loss of something useful they could learn to do if they weren't jedi. Heck one of your eventual companions could even be a padawan that grows into a jedi as you level together. That would be the ultimate Old Republic MMO>

I think they're doing something like that for Star Trek Online... except without the Jedi. You make your own bridge crew or whatever.

Well I read the article and it said something about interactive companions and a party structure like Kotor. Like if you piss off your NPC companions they'll leave on you. So its not unreasonable to expect at least some of what I am after. I will be sad if your NPC companions don't fight/aren't vital to your ability to be successful/don't level ect.

Guild Wars Nightfall had something similar to your idea by letting you have Heroes, which are allies you got to customize their skills, weapons, armor, etc.. though their main class and apperance weren't changable.

And let's not forget that heroes in Guild Wars basically destroyed the entire "Massively Multiplayer" aspect of it. It's one thing to give players a "party", and then require them to coordinate with other players' parties to accomplish anything, but it's quite another to allow the player to finish everything without interacting with a single person, as they did in Guild Wars.

Hate to burst your bubble, but I already made this topic before, and it too, was met with almost universal animosity.

I for one, am looking forward to it.

And... PCs arent dead until I can play shooters on XBOX with a fucking mouse.

Umm, there have been adapters for that for a while.

Still... VIVA LA PC GAMING!

I hate AI for party members in MMOs, especially the one for the henchmen and heroes in guild wars. It's always lacking and inefficient. I just want to kill things in an MMO, not manage my party members.

Yeah, but thats an analog conversion of the mouse output to the X and Y of the thumbsticks. In short, its just not the same and point and click headshots.

So...race ideas? I'm interested to see how they do races. It'd be nice to see them not have races tied to faction sides so you don't have people going Horde because they want to be a Tauren like in WoW.

I'm all for Twi'Lek, Bothan, Rodian, Droid, Wookie...then Human-races of course.

Just replace "Horde" with "Alliance" and "Tauren" with "Night Elf" and you have an accurate statement!

The D20 rules for Star Wars had a good selection of races.
And you left out the best race of all, Mon Calamari.
Akbar my Mon Calamari jedi was a master surgeon and a fish!

So you're saying he was a master sturgeon?

For that, you should be punished.

Fixed that for you. Mr. McBarrelpants should be ashamed for not noticing that!

Read between the lines for once in your life.

I don't even want to talk about the night elf situation in WoW.

Those were just races I'd personally like to play, but you do raise an interesting question: in a universe of canon as vast as star wars, where do they cap the races?

Well if you look at star wars galaxies, its a good way to tell how their going to take care of the races. That's what I believe atleast... I could be wrong.

I'm pretty sure Bioware is smart enough to try and avoid Galaxies relations as much as possible.

I always thought galaxies was a decent game...

You probably played it when it was fun, then.

Statement: I just want to play an HK droid. If they can provide that, I'll probably buy a copy whether it sucks or not.

-Anim

Well, when you start added in nearly unknown races from the Expanded Universe, or from the uh, Christmas Special, then thats a good point to stop.

I would love to play Vong, except I don't think they were around or active in that era. Little glimpses in the Clone Wars, but nothing circa KOTOR.

I think Canderous mentioned them (Described them, I mean, he had no idea what they were) in the first game.

The only people that would have an inkling of their existence would be the Sith that still live beyond the outer rim. But to see them anywhere other than the rim, especially during Old Republic times, would be canon-breaking.

They were a little ways past the rim, actually, if I remember his story correctly.

Basically, "Way the fuck out there."

But, you can still hope for some New Jedi Order-timeline games. I hear it's popularity is increasing.

Anyway-- Heres to hoping EA refrains from their typical douchebaggery with this one. I'm still unhappy about what was done to Earth and Beyond, after they bought Westwood.

I actually think I recall going "Oh crap, that sounds like the Vong" at some point during that game now...you've apparently stimulated some subconscious vault of that game. Which means I need to go replay it.

I do see Cid's point of view, though...wouldn't be surprised if they got mentioned a few times the game, though. I'd say expansion leading to a Vong War, except that if there'd been any kind of large-scale encounter with them, there would have been a record of it for the New Republic jedi to find during their own war.

I'm hoping we don't get slammed with a standard "human" race, even though I know it'll probably happen; I mean Mandalorians are technically human but their entire culture is so much different from, say, a Corellian, that to lump them into the same group would be disheartening. Unless they work in some kind of "home planet" system.


e: Here's to hoping EA does little more than just push funds to Bioware, to be honest.

Here's hoping EA doesn't affect the game whatsoever.

Galaxies IS a decent game... most people don't think so because they're still butthurt (and rightly so) that the game they were playing was totally taken apart and put back together in a format that was much more simple.

They tend to think about the 'old days' while wearing rose-tinted sunglasses... Pre-CU and Pre-NGE was buggy as hell, if I remember aright. Wasn't all sunshine and daisies, like the former players would have you believe. And yes, I do still play the game, before anyone starts harping on me about it.

I'm looking forward to SW:TOR, actually... though I DO wonder what's going to happen to Galaxies when it hits. LA's hoping that the two are different enough that they'll be able to keep most of the subscriber base in Galaxies. I'm not so optimistic... although... maybe all the kiddies that came to Galaxies to play Jedi will leave for TOR... and we can actually have a diverse community again...

*slaps self* Dammit, Nine, stop with the wishful thinking!

What I liked about galaxies was that they rewarded veterans. I'm doubtfull but hoping for the best.

Galaxies would've been alright without the Jedi, at least once they fixed the bugs. Less popular because no one wants to play a Star Wars game without being a Jedi, but the way they were implemented in Galaxies was just broken and a slippery slope to what it's become today. I liked the very diverse skill trees, although there were some combinations that resulted in virtual immunity, from what I recall.

What I liked most about Galaxies was the space combat, particularly being able to customize your ship, and with a very (very) diverse selection of ships. I always thought if they took that engine and made it into a stand alone game, wherein you are essentially a mercenary that can eventually choose either pirate, Imperial or New Republic factions, it would've been pretty good. There certainly haven't been many popular space shooters recently.

If I get a new computer I'll probably shoot for galaxies...

There definitely need to be astromech droids. I don't care what time period it takes place in, just as long as I play a whirring/beeping/clicking droid that repairs all manner of technology and easily interfaces with all forms of AI. Probably a sort of "healer" for the group, or maybe a Rogue-type in that they can access items and information that others are unable to.

Let's not forget the utility droids like C3P0

Screw astromechs and utility droids, I want to be a goddamned IG-88 model, please.

Seconded. Psycho personality droids, please.

Which droids were those?

I object to all of you and your silly assassin droids.

OOT - There needs to be an exclamation point at the end instead of a period...

Statement: Repair is one of the most important skills for an assassin droid. No one else can be trusted to repair or upgrade your functionality.

Condescending Inquiry: And who would even consider playing an IG-88 model when HK's are available?

-Anim

Query: Are you aware of who IG-88 is?


[sidenote: I will never, EVER use HK speak again. It just sounded weird without it.]

Um, no?

IG-88 was one of 4 Droid Bounty Hunter's that were operational during the events of Episodes 4,5 and 6

Especially between 5 and 6.



My problem with Galaxies is that they started out with a basically fun game with some problems and then started breaking it over and over again. They needed to start fixing the classes that were blatantly obviously better than everyone else (bounty hunter, commando) and ones that were just flat out shit (Squad Leader). And the fixes they implemented did exactly the opposite of that, just taking away the enjoyment.

Like, okay, here's your world. Guns and armor decay after a while and eventually are unusable. Well, that sucks, but oh well, there's no penalty for dying, so it's cool. The only thing you need is Entertainers to get rid of Mind wounds, and Doctors to heal Health and Action. That relies on PCs. Oh, well, maybe they'll fix that.

And they did! Not too long after release, you get instantly 100 damage on all three of HAM every time you spawn at a clone tube! Woo!

Okay, well, that wasn't what I meant. I would have put in NPC doctors and dancers so you could heal, you know, when people didn't feel like standing around playing shitty music and dancing the Robot or playing 'Doctor'.

Two months later; new patch! 10% durability damage each time you die!

Isn't this fun?!

Indignant Response: What are you trying to prove by imitating the speech patterns of an HK unit, meatbag?

Statement: The original HK-47 was the personal assassin of Revan, Dark Lord of the Sith. IG-88 was one of a dozen assassins hired by Darth Vader for a single job. What does this tell you about comparative skill and sophistication?

-Anim

Let's not bring Darth Vador and droids into the talk, he did create C3P0 afterall... Or as I call it, the wuss droid...

Vader just wanted to get the job done, there's nothing wrong with having collateral. It's a competition to get the bounty, that's what bounty hunter's do.

And if I remember correctly, IG-88 was some kind of financial droid. I mean christ he was a friggin bean counter. Who started killing things.

And they say it's video games that makes people want to kill one another.