The Warring States of NPF

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-   -   12 year old boy becomes girl; parents upset (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=36011)

Aerozord 09-20-2009 12:53 AM

I dont know, I mean although I am personally against sex changes on the grounds that gender is a function of culture not biology, I do support a persons personal choices. I dislike how things are designated "for girls" or "for boys". That being said, this was a bad idea. You have to be able to make a distinction between how people should react and how they would. He is violating social mores on such a deep level just about anyone would react badly. The parents should have explained this.

You cant hit kids over the head with social acceptance. Humans naturally reject that which is different. Unless the entire culture accepted this, there was no way to avoid it. Its unreasonable to expect different.

Kim 09-20-2009 01:17 AM

On the one hand I think it would have been better to wait until he was an adult, since I think making the change would be easier, at least in the sense that he will have fewer people giving him trouble to deal with, and he'll also be better able to cope with the people who do give him trouble.

On the other hand, it will save him trouble in the future.

I'm very unsure on how to feel about it.

bluestarultor 09-20-2009 01:18 AM

I'm with Aero. I know that a lot of times, gender dismorphia (I believe that's the correct term for it) is apparent from a very young age. Little boys preferring dolls and makeup or little girls being into roughhousing and cars, etc. I get that that leads to a lot of social problems and teasing and such, because I got harassed for a hell of a lot less, like just reading books and sucking at physical activity.

On the other hand, the entire "POOF!!! I'm a GIRL now!" thing is a lot to spring on a kid or even a teen, and you can bet the crap the subject in question took for being femmy is going to double or triple.

Bells 09-20-2009 01:27 AM

I'm honestly not capable of passing beyond the fact that he is 12 years old.

and then i saw this:

the same case with a 9 year old

...Is this a Hoax?

For fuck sakes! 12 and 9?! That's not an age where ANY kid can form a rational though and say "I would like to change my GENDER now". C'mon!

Rymramoch 09-20-2009 01:27 AM

Ah, but gender is not truly, or fully, a function of culture.

Quote:

Genetic link to gender identity
October 30th, 2008

In the largest ever genetic study of male to female transsexuals Australian researchers have found a significant genetic link between gender identity and a gene involved in testosterone action.

From an early age people develop an inner sense of being male or female – their gender identity. Transsexuals however, identify with a physical sex opposite to their perceived biological sex.

DNA samples were collected from 112 male to female transsexuals and researchers compared genetic differences with non transsexuals. The results are published in the high impact journal Biological Psychiatry.

The researchers discovered that male to female transsexuals were more likely to have a longer version of a gene which is known to modify the action of the sex hormone testosterone.

"We think that these genetic differences might reduce testosterone action and under masculinise the brain during foetal development." said researcher Lauren Hare.

For decades, there has been debate over the causes of transexuality. Early theories included psychosocial factors such as childhood trauma. More recent studies have indicated that family history and genetic aspects are linked to the development of gender identity.

"There is a social stigma that transsexualism is simply a lifestyle choice, however our findings support a biological basis of how gender identity develops." said study leader Associate Professor Vincent Harley, Head of Molecular Genetics at Prince Henry's Institute.

"As with all genetic association studies it will be important to replicate these findings in other populations" said Associate Professor Vincent Harley.

Researchers are now planning even larger genetic studies and are investigating a wider range of genes that may be related to gender identity.

Source: Research Australia
(http://www.physorg.com/news144579930.html)

In addition there are people who have found gender differences in the Sexually Dimorphic Nucleus (a nerve cluster that is found in the brain which is twice the size in females) and that apparently a majority of transsexual individuals have a SDN more similar to the sex they were not born as (though this was a fairly small study as it can only be examined during an autopsy).


Quote:

He is violating social mores on such a deep level just about anyone would react badly. The parents should have explained this.
I am slightly confused, did you mean the parents of the kid in question should ave explained this to him/her?

P.S. I apologize somewhat if I sound like an ass, but, just as we are still striving to understand and accept gay/lesbian people, there are so many misconceptions about transgendered people out there. Just as most, if not all, gay/lesbian people do not choose to be how they are most transgendered people would want to just be happy with how they are as it would make their lives so much simpler.

Fifthfiend 09-20-2009 01:35 AM

From the article it reads like the school is being demonized for a situation in which they themselves had no advanced notice, at least this is what I gather from the bits where the kid purportedly showed up on whichver day in a dress saying his name had been changed and the teaching staff then having an emergency assembly. From what I can tell the school did the best they could in terms of trying to get the kids not to be awful shits to this kid. Does anyone think this would have worked out any better had the school just not said anything and left the kids to work things out for themselves? If the kid's parents wanted things dealt with more sensitively then it was their job to work out with the school in advance how it was to be dealt with.

...Adding to that the standard disclaimer/complaint that this thread/news story suffers the same glaring deficiency of every such shocking/extremely personalized "news" story in which all we have is a very very faint thumbnail sketch of a situation going on thousands of miles from anywhere where it could ever actually affect any of our lived and in which everything of significance about it comes down to details that none of us will ever know and so any of us can do is cobble together a threadbare patchwork of an understanding based on the little bit we're told in one news story and then spackle in the inevitably massive holes with our own assumptions and prejudices.

It would almost be more useful to posit pure hypotheticals as then we would at least all be working from the outset with a straightforward agreed-upon set of facts about the situation.

Rymramoch 09-20-2009 02:26 AM

so true, so true

Bells 09-20-2009 02:54 AM

Indeed. Although i must say that anything related to sex change involving 9 and 12 year old kids is borderline insane. I can't honestly think of a scenario were it would seem right at all.

krogothwolf 09-20-2009 03:07 AM

I disagree with sex change myself, but I think the parents are being upset for a silly reason.

First is even if they were informed and talked to their kids it wont stop them from making fun of the new kid, and not all parents are rational on this subject either and could also say derogatory remarks about this kid that their kids will repeat. Second is, some of this stuff is a private matter between the kid and his parents themselves. They only needed to report to the school his name had been changed. The school also really can't really inform the parents or kids on this until it becomes public knowledge either. It would be like a kid getting cancer treatment and the school not saying anything on it. They aren't allowed because its a private fact with the kid and their family.

I don't agree with sex changes, and definitely not for people so young. But that is personal opinion and I don't begrudge people making their own choices and I don't think it should be a big deal at all that its happening.

Frogman 09-20-2009 05:47 AM

Wait... so everyone is on my side for this one... sweet!


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