The Warring States of NPF

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Tommathy 06-30-2004 01:23 PM

Va Hb 751
 
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...?041+sum+HB750
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...?041+sum+HB751

Not the marriage part, the part restricting contracts giving marriage-like benefits between two people of the same sex.

It not only restricts Civil Unions, it restricts one's ability to, say, give power of attorney to ones same-sex partner, or specifically to allow him hospital visitation rights , etc.

Discuss.

Fifthfiend 06-30-2004 02:14 PM

I don't know where it bars power of attourney for people of the same sex -- as long as those rights aren't given based on the existence of a same-sex relationship (since power of attourney isn't specifically restricted to marriage). At least that's my reading of the language on "partnership contracts." Anything marriage-specific, though, like spousal priviledges in hospital visits, spousal confidentiality in legal matters, etc., is gone.

Although it's wacky-ass Virginia, so who the hell knows?

LordTobias 06-30-2004 03:36 PM

I think the biggest draw back on any kind of same sex marriages is quite simple. Most people are just not comfortable with it. At all.

So, it creates all those extra problems...Stupid politicians! Anyway, like fifthfiend said, it IS Virginia...

Crodevillian Team 06-30-2004 04:46 PM

Ouch. And it even nullifies spousal rights given by other states. Virginia will have to change its motto: "Virginia is for lovers- except those specifically outlined in Virginia House Bill 751, in which case you need to check your rights at the door." I can only hope that eventually stupid legislation like this will be thrown out like stupid legislations have in the past, and everyone in years to come will wonder why legislation like this was ever supported.

[Edit]: I am also under the impression that bills like this would be unconstitutional, specifically the part that invalidates rights granted in other states. Here, in section 2 of article IV of the US Constitution.

"Section 2. The citizens of each state shall be entitled to all privileges and immunities of citizens in the several states."

This next item I found on another website, and thought it brought up some good points. Please forgive me if it's been posted before, or if it's really old. If the loop was here, and I was there, then here would be right here, and there would be on Mars.

(Before I post it, though, I should point out that the entire list is a satire; that means that it's sarcastic, and is pointing out the fallacies in the arguments used by people to oppose Gay Marriage. This means that this list is Pro-Gay-Marriage. It also means that *I* am Pro-Gay-Marriage. I know I sound like I'm talking down to everyone, but I just want to make it clear, because some people have a tendency to take things too literally. [Anyone remember that Lord of the Rings list? ;-)]

28 reasons to oppose gay marriage. (Remember, it's a satire!)

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control.

2. Marriage is valuable because it produces children, which is why we deny marriage rights to infertile couples and old people.

3. Obviously, gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.

4. Straight marriage, such as Britney Spears' 55-hour escapade, will be less meaningful if gay marriage is allowed.

5. Marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all: women are property, matches are arranged in childhood, blacks can't marry whites, Catholics can't marry Jews, divorce is illegal, and adultery is punishable by death.

6. Gay marriage should be decided by people, not the courts, because majority-elected legislatures have historically protected the rights of minorities.

7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.

8. There is no separation between religious marriage and legal marriage, because there is no separation of church and state.

9. Devout, faithful Anglicans should never accept same-sex marriage, because it is an affront to the traditional family values upheld by Henry VIII and his wife, Catherine of Aragon, and his wife, Anne Boleyn, and his wife, Jane Seymour, and his wife, Anne of Cleves, and his wife, Catherine Howard, and his wife, Catherine Parr. They all knew the meaning of marriage and none of them lost their heads over the matter.

10. Married gay people will encourage others to be gay, in a way that unmarried gay people do not.

11. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because dogs have legal standing and can sign marriage contracts.

12. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to legislative change in general, which could possibly include the legalization of polygamy and incest. Because we don't know what comes next, we should never change our laws.

13. Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.

14. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms because we haven't adapted to things like suburban malls and tupperware parties.

15. Legal marriage will inspire gays to mimic the straight traditions of spiritual commitment ceremonies and celebratory parties, which is currently impermissible for them to do and which they have never done before.

16. Marriage is designed to protect the well-being of children. Gay people do not need marriage because they never have children from prior relationships, artificial insemination or surrogacy, or adoption.

17. Civil unions are a good option because "separate but equal" institutions are always constitutional. In fact, compared with marriage, civil unions are so attractive that straight people are calling dibs on them.

18. A man should not be able to marry whomever a woman can marry, and a woman should not be able to marry whomever a man can marry, because in this country we do not believe in gender equality.

19. If gays marry, some of straight people's tax dollars would end up going to families whose structure they may find morally objectionable. Clearly, it is more just to continue taking gay people's tax dollars to support straight families, who are going to heaven regardless of what anyone else thinks of them.

20. Gays should hold off on the marriage question until society is more accepting of them, because they are not part of society.

21. The people's voice must be heard on this issue. Therefore, we must have a referendum on a constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage, because we can't think of any other way to discuss the issue.

22. Each state should decide for itself whether gay marriage will be recognized, because there is no "full faith and credit" clause that requires states to recognize each other's institutions.

23. Gay marriage attempts to replace natural heterosexual instinct with a cultural institution. Morality demands that we subordinate institutionalized commitment to raw, unfettered, biological impulse.

24. Gay marriages could very well suffer maladies like domestic violence and substance abuse. That's why we invented the Quality Control department to pre-approve the righteousness of all marriage applicants, such as convicted serial killer Richard Ramirez who married a woman while on Death Row.

25. Those who support gay marriage aim to overthrow the dominant culture, as evidenced by their enthusiasm to participate in it.

26. The country can't afford to provide benefits for married gay couples. That's why Bush would never consider spending $150 million on programs that encourage more straight people to get married.

27. Gay couples do not deserve marriage because, if everyone on earth limited themselves to same-sex sexual behavior, humanity would soon be extinct. Based on the same concern, we also deny marriage rights to the biologically childless and to those who have borne only one child. (We are also considering denying marriage rights to those who have borne three or more children, because if everyone copied them, the world population would shoot through the roof.)

28. Marriage was created in the Bible as a bond between a man and a woman. The people who lived prior to the writing of the Bible, such as the Chinese, sat around in confusion for many years until the Mesopotamians finally came around and invented the family unit.

I especially like numbers 3, 9, 17, and 28.

Fifthfiend 06-30-2004 05:08 PM

Quote:

5. Marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all: women are property, matches are arranged in childhood, blacks can't marry whites, Catholics can't marry Jews, divorce is illegal, and adultery is punishable by death.
Don't forget the Rule of Thumb. What kind of civilization would we have without our proud tradition of common-law-sanctioned wifebeating?

Dona Maria 06-30-2004 07:05 PM

croteam6, i want that link. very awesome. will add more when i read the original articles.

MP37a 06-30-2004 07:40 PM

Haha number 28 made me chuckle.

Crodevillian Team 06-30-2004 08:25 PM

I'm sorry- I don't know the original source of the reasons, so I don't know who to credit them to. Every forum I go to that has the list posted says the same thing;

"I found this on another forum, and thought it was funny. I don't know the original author."

Unfortunately, I have to say the same thing. I've done some Google searching, but located nothing. I like it a lot; I'm just sorry I don't know who wrote them. If anyone does happen to find the answer, please let me know.

Viper Daimao 06-30-2004 11:48 PM

I suspect that this wont pass. the tide seems to be turning toward tolerance. just a few months ago an anti-gay amendment was defeated in Kansas. yes, in Kansas. lets face it, if you cant win there, you're doomed.

with such divided issues like this, i feel its best left up to the states to decided. which is partly why i will opposed the federal marriage amendment if its anything more than the defense of marriage act. the other reason, of course, being I dont view gay marriage as wrong.

Tommathy 07-01-2004 10:54 AM

It actually did pass (by a veto proof margin), even though our Governor fought to remove that last bit.

It takes effect, umm, today actually.


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