The Warring States of NPF

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RiseOfTheGeckos 01-20-2005 04:37 AM

You're all forgetting something extremely important about the Hadoken here.

Specifically, why exactly love is so powerful. Black mage says it himself: love is a powerful emotion. How could anyone argue with this? Remember the Trojan wars? The face that launched a thousand ships? Love is passion, which can lead to an infinite number of possibilities. Why would any man volunteer to serve in an army and go to war? For the love of his country, homeland, or family, and his resulting desire to see them safe. Therefore, through love, he would pick up a weapon and slay his fellow man.

There have been a lot of comparisons indicating hate and love as polar opposites, but I think love is less a polar end as it is a central point. Killing is certainly not a loving act, yet people killing for love is not unheard of. Love, when faced with rejection or loss, can lead to despair, bitterness, resentment, and to hate itself, making hate a potential byproduct of love. Just another possibility love could lead to, rather than a polar opposite.

Without love, people don't take action. The love of wealth can drive a person to go out of their way to achieve that wealth by whatever means necessary, as long as it doesn't compromise something they love more, such as their dignity. Love is passion, passion is drive, and drive leads to accomplishment.

Hence, the Hadoken is powered by this intense generator of accomplishment and change. Love is not inherently good or evil, it is simply extremely powerful. Powerful enough to control what people do with their lives.

Hate, on the other hand, is a weak and narrow emotion by comparison. What does hatred lead to? Not much. Destruction, or failure followed by shame. And since hate can be generated by love itself, hate is already beneath love in power.

Any spell powered by hate would be obliterated by a spell powered by love.

Besides, counter-acting the effects of Hadoken should not include the restoration of love at all. The effects of Hadoken are pure, indiscriminate destruction. Consumption of love is nothing more than the power source used to accomplish this.

So any spell that would be able to counteract Hadoken would have to draw its power from something at least as strong as love, if not something stronger. Its effects? That depends on whether we're talking about stopping a hadoken in progress (i.e. an immensly powerful "reflect" spell), or simply reversing the effects of the destruction caused by a hadoken (i.e. an immensly powerful healing spell).

secretskull 01-20-2005 04:58 AM

I hate to say it but your mistaken they are opposites love is just liking someone only more so and hate is just disliking someone only more so as well. Besides hate can cause things too. The hate of a person or country can cause you to join a war, you don't necessarily have to love the country your with. Also Hate can generate love as well what about "Stockholm Syndrome" and if you hate someone and you spend all your time stalking him/her you might begin to notice his/her good points and fall in love. That go's to show you hate can generate love and vice versa.

RiseOfTheGeckos 01-20-2005 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by secretskull
love is just liking someone only more so

We disagree. There is much, much more to the emotion called "love" than "really really liking someone a whole bunch."

As for hating an entire nation to join a war against it, I could still argue that noone would hate a nation for no reason. There's always a root cause in love. People tend not to really hate someone or something unless that entity poses a threat to something they love. Otherwise, why would you hate it? Back when the USSR was around, the "Iron Curtain" was the looming threat that communism take over Europe. The people who opposed this were people who loved Democracy, or whichever form of government they supported instead of Communism. If the USSR hadn't posed even the slightest threat to worldwide Democracy, would anyone have hated them? No, of course not.

As for the Stockholm Syndrome case, again hate has been introduced but the scenario is too vague without a cause for the hate. What would cause a person to stalk someone else out of hate? What about that person warrents such hatred? Any answer you could come up with could be traced back to the love of something, and the obsessive desire to protect it.

Also, you mentioned that after stalking someone out of hatred, one begins to love that person because they would begin to notice things they like about that person. Noticing things you like is not born from hatred. It's simply recognizing similarities between things you love and behaviors or thoughts that occur in another person. Hate was never necessary to discover that. While the hate (which again is by my argument generated by obsessive love) brought about the stalking, there was never any direct connection between the person's hatred and the love that developed. They simply recognized things they loved in a person they were watching. Hate only had indirect involvment in this; they didn't discover their love because they hated the person, they discovered it because they were watching the person long enough to see them do things they loved.

Lycanthrope 01-20-2005 06:12 AM

"Hate is only love with its back turned"
-Terry Pratchett.

By Mr. Pratchett's definition, and one I fully endorce as well, the opposite of love is loathing, the wish never to be near or associated with someone. Hate is an emotion that makes one actively seek out and cause pain to someone, where loathing they avoid contact entirely.

minakata_moriya 01-21-2005 04:58 PM

Im reallly sorry to bring the end to this discussion, specially since I enjoyed the neko-dah stuff but Brian already answered this one for us.
Remember the episode when Figther is trying to pull out the hadoken and messed-up ?
Even when its not within the storyline, its clearly stated that it was the opossite of the hadoken.( I really dont want to ruin the episode for anyone, so if you dont know, you should really look in up, does anyone remembers the number of the episode?)

yoav 01-23-2005 10:54 AM

minakata_moriya wrong wrong wrong
A.That was a guest comic and therefore doesn't have anything to do with Brian's work or the "real" 8-bit theater world.
B.It says it's a way to balance the hadoken not the exact oppsite from it.

The episode is here: http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=021130

Kupo-chan 01-25-2005 05:49 PM

I was actuallyabout to bring that up..I hadnt thought of it until after a 3-hour Street Fighter playing session...but..I dunno if its really the OPPOSITE..then again, I know practically nothing about anything in streed fighter.


...On a side note, Silly Fighter, Its Quarter-Circle P, not Not Down, back, THEN bolth ^^'

Loyal 01-25-2005 05:59 PM

If you're talking about Fighter's "Just a quarter-circle from front to back. Simple,"-line, he was most likely talking about Fire Dance from FF6.

Kupo-chan 01-25-2005 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loyal2NES
If you're talking about Fighter's "Just a quarter-circle from front to back. Simple,"-line, he was most likely talking about Fire Dance from FF6.

Wel....Hm. I actually wasent, I dont even remeber that quote...Wow, A quote I dont remember.

mammothtank 01-25-2005 09:21 PM

Are you guys talking about this? It's "a half-circle from back to front." And yes, that is the input for Sabin's Fire Dance.


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