ooc: people think for themselves? hardly. Most people are willing to entrust their decisions and freedoms to governments and corporations. The people who actually think for themselves are few and far between. Nazi germany was a very educated and technoligically advanced society and they were quite easily duped in to some of the most horrific and inhuman autrosities.

(OOC: Jad, just join a real debate team where your usage of big oversized words is somewhat useful, don't try to educate us all here...like the old saying, "Arguing online is like playing in the Special Olympics..." and so on and so forth...I guess if Celes wants there to be more guards, they'll be waiting outside right? And has Thid always had that magicpower, like since the sign-up, and never used it, or is it just-now-injected? Cuz I want my guy to begin to use some real Dragoon powers...not just Jump...but that'll be for later...)

OOC: Yes, but we are people who think for themselves. With us here, it can be made out obviously that your guy is 'evil'. And Germany was a shithole, and they just wanted out of being a shithole. This place is not a shithole

[OOC]
Ya'll are STILL arguing? By the gods... -_-# Both of you just stop it now... you're never going to agree on this anyway, so why keep going on and on and irritating the crap out of the rest of us?

OOC: We're men

ooc: how do you know this place isn't a shithole? We have monsters running about all over. We know nothing of how the peasants are treated, the state of the economy, or even the popularity of the royal family.

OOC: Because shitholes don't have great armies a day after a new king comes into power, and the others are Celes' choices.

[OOC]
Your point? Is it that men are just natural stupid by continuing to egg each other on like little two year olds? Grrrrr... I'm out. Going to go blow steam by yelling at idiot drivers instead of trying to be nice and get you guys to stop before Celes comes back and sees all this crap.

OOC: Yes... Don't you have a brother or something?

ooc: lot's of shitholes had, or have good armies. soviet union, North Korea, Spain before the rennaisance, etc.