Smash Bros Brawl Extravaganza Part 4 - Now With 40% More Metagame

[Loyal]

Ike has a lot (A LOT) of power, and a few moves that can't really be countered by anything other than precognition or just waiting it out from a safe distance (most of his B moves, specifically). However, his approach is hideously predictable when it comes down to it, so he needs to play a half-defensive, half-mindgamey game to win against a skilled player.

And as Mauve said he's ridiculously easy to edgeguard. See 1:34 of this video (actually, watch the whole thing if you haven't already).

But his F-smash, in addition to being RIDICULOUSLY powerful and having a VERY large hitbox, is deceptively mindgamey in its own right.

Ike's pretty much the ultimate nubgrinder, but he starts to fall short in competitive play.

[bananarama]

How about Ike's counter? I know it's more powerful than Marth's and everything, but is it slower. Cause I seriously haven't seen anybody use his counter... Oh yeah and does anybody know if Ike has a tip?

Also, you know how if Sudden Death lasts too long, Bombombs start falling from the air? I recently saw a guy catch one of them in mid-air and use it to kill his opponent.... it was frickin' awesome...

[Mirai Gen]

Ike's pretty good - I love him because I loved Roy and the very idea of a powerful, sluggish, one-hit-KO machine with a sword was just sexy as hell, but Roy sucked horribly.

Ike's main problem is he has no real 'quick' attacks that have no startup lag, except maybe Ftilt and Fair. Which means that he feels the effects of the new stale moves on damage and knockback the most out of everyone.

I'll still play him relentlessly and love every damn second of it, but he's got his hefty flaws.

EDIT: One thing I don't like is that they changed the way Ike/Roy and Marth's counters work as opposed to Melee. It used to be Marth = 7% flat damage and pitiful KO and Roy = 1.5 damage and KO, now it's just a solid 1.1 and 1.2 for Marth and Ike respectively. A little disappointing.

[Dular]

My main man is Ike and Bowser, and my brother is usually Shiek, Wolf, or Captain Falcon, and his main strategy is air juggling, where mine is 'win'. Were both excellent players, but he always go more on speed and I'm always more on power. Now from my experience with Ike, I can tell you one thing.

You'll want to use your basic triple-a attack often. Very often. It's like hitting them with a smash but without a charge up time. Oh, and never counter. Ever. It takes a second to charge up before it actually takes effect, and I think the counter lasts a little longer than Marth's. Even then, don't use it. There will simply be very few chances to actually get the timing down against your opponent.

Ike is the man. I've only lost once as him against my bro.

[Odjn]

Triple A is the easiest way to get 13% in the game. I love it. I've actually had a lot of success with Ike's counter, I haven't seen the one second start up you've been talking about. It has excellent knockback, but so does every other attack. I saw a cute little move, Ike runs over to the guy, the players hits the opposite direction to make him hop that way, then he nails him with the back air and he goes flying. Need to practice that.

Perhaps Ike's speed is a problem in one on one when competitive players will shoot him but honestly we may have some items this time around.

And I can still dream of using heavies to compete!

[Loyal]

Perhaps Ike's speed is a problem in one on one when competitive players will shoot him but honestly we may have some items this time around.

Oh, there's no question about it, Ike DESTROYS in FFA.

But, no... there still won't be items. Partially because of the past, but mostly because the items are almost universally hideously overpowered in this game.

How about Ike's counter? I know it's more powerful than Marth's and everything, but is it slower. Cause I seriously haven't seen anybody use his counter... Oh yeah and does anybody know if Ike has a tip?

Ike's counter has about a half-second startup time before it can actually counter anything. But it does have that +10% over Marth's.

Ike's main problem is he has no real 'quick' attacks that have no startup lag, except maybe Ftilt and Fair. Which means that he feels the effects of the new stale moves on damage and knockback the most out of everyone.

I don't see what you're saying here. Stale Moves only applies when you keep spamming the same moves - And Ike's moves are almost ALL kill moves. You spam the jab combo and Fair to rack up damage, then finish them with an FSmash or just about anything else in his arsenal that's equally useable.

His moves are almost universally slow and powerful, which gives you a variety of slow and powerful attacks to use - There's nothing situational about any of them. Just straight up high damage and/or knockback moves.

...Also, his Bair comes out really quick, but has a noticably smaller hitbox compared to the rest of his attacks and no small amount of lag at the end.

[mudah.swf]

You know a lot of people are complaining about this game being too campy. Wouldn't items allow characters without a good ranged attack to get some sort of ranged attack so they can cope better against characters with projectiles perhaps?

[Loyal]

The problem is that the characters who already have projectiles have an equal-yet-random shot at getting said items.

On the positive side, there HAS been discussion - albeit quickly quashed discussion, but highly valid nonetheless - of making Final Destination a counterpick stage instead of neutral. The unfriendly ledges and camper-encouraging flatness is really putting up a fight.

[Mirai Gen]

I don't think that would be too terrible of an idea. The new Ledgegrab mechanic for lighter characters, tether recoveries, and changed Brawl physics makes it so FD is neutral ground but still gives lots of advantage to the lights.

Also, I swear there was something that was said that Stale Moves applies much more harshly than before and a breakdown of it. I'm searching Smashboards to find it right now.

[Loyal]

It DOES apply far more harshly than before. The point is, Ike has so many killing moves at his disposal that you could assign any number of them to "damage dealer" roles and he'd still be perfectly capable of knocking them out of the park when their damage goes high enough.

There's also the strategic value of deliberately weakening a specific move for comboing purposes.