Smash Bros Brawl Extravaganza Part 4 - Now With 40% More Metagame

[Mirai Gen]

The point is, Ike has so many killing moves at his disposal that you could assign any number of them to "damage dealer" roles and he'd still be perfectly capable of knocking them out of the park when their damage goes high enough.

True as that may be, his moves are laggy enough on startup that he is laughably easy to dodge with Fsmash and Aether and Usmash. Most of his damage dealing is resorting from grab, A once, then upthrow and Nair/Fair/Bair.

I like Ike too but he seriously is too laggy to sufficiently combo. The most you can really do is hit them with one of his attacks that's strong enough to knock them away and cause damage, and hope to repeat that over and over. And that flat out is not nearly as reliable as true inescapable combos that the quicker characters have.

[mudah.swf]

Current Evo tourney rules are as follows:

Evo Brawl Beta Ruleset Revision 16
These rules are tentative and subject to change at any time.

First game of a match to be played on Evo Custom Map. Players can decide to play on any map, if both players agree.
Excessive stalling or abusing terrain to not engage the enemy is not prohibited, and can be enforced by a tournament director only. This will result in a loss of the match.
Losing player can pick a new stage or new character, not both.
Winner keeps character (users of Samus/Zamus, Zelda/Shiek, and Pokemon Trainer are currently ALLOWED to change which character/mode they start in even after a win) but must select character/mode before other player has to choose stage/character.
2 Stock, 3 Min timer, 3/5 Games
Items on medium spawn.
Sudden Death will decide the outcome of the game.
Allowed Items: Banana Peel, Unira, Spring, Mr. Saturn, Green Shell, Smoke Ball, Freezie, Super Scope, Sandbag, Food, Screw Attack, Warp Star, Metal Box, Bunny Hood, Beam Sword, Baseball Bat, Lip's Stick, Star Rod, Hothead, Smash Ball, Ray Gun, Pitfall, Cracker Launcher, Motion-Sensor Bomb, Hammer, Golden Hammer, Bumper, Blast Box, Franklin Badge.
Banned Stages: New Pork City, Hyrule Temple, Warioware, Spear Pillar, Flat Zone 2, Original Mario Brothers, Mushroomy Kingdom, Norfair.

Go nuts.

[Loyal]

Evo? What's that?

Though I wonder why Norfair, with its predictable and easily-avoided hazards (sky-high lava wave can be shielded or spot-dodged with minimal penalty), would be banned?

[EDIT] Perhaps a link is in order?

I like Ike too but he seriously is too laggy to sufficiently combo. The most you can really do is hit them with one of his attacks that's strong enough to knock them away and cause damage, and hope to repeat that over and over. And that flat out is not nearly as reliable as true inescapable combos that the quicker characters have.

To be fair, NOBODY can legitimately combo, period. Airdodging can be done almost immediately after being hit, making it entirely possible to break out of most moves (exceptions include stuff like D3's infinite and most chaingrabs, which stay on the ground mostly and aren't subject to airdodge rules).

[EDITEDIT] Okay, this is just insane.

[mudah.swf]

Evo is the US's biggest fighting game tournament and Brawl will be played at this year's Evo. Those are the current rules for that tournament.

[Loyal]

I dug around and found the very link I had asked for. Click

I think I can safely say there won't be a lot of competitive Smashers going to Evo. It also seems pretty obvious that Evo is going not for a truly competitive game (some of the things on that list make absolutely no sense and I'm not talking about the items), but more or less just to piss off the SWF userbase.

[mudah.swf]

The SRK view on things is to only ban stuff once everything's been tested throughly, instead of grandfathering in rules from previous games like SWF did with Brawl. I don't get why they want SDs though.

Unless this is all just a huge prank on behalf of Mr Wizard himself?

[Mirai Gen]

I saw those rules a few days ago, I hope it's a joke. Items are ridiculously powered already (Cracker Launcher, a super ranged weapon? Pitfall, a free meteor or a free smash? The Smash Ball? Come on). Putting them in tournaments would be a nightmare.

To be fair, NOBODY can legitimately combo, period. Airdodging can be done almost immediately after being hit, making it entirely possible to break out of most moves (exceptions include stuff like D3's infinite and most chaingrabs, which stay on the ground mostly and aren't subject to airdodge rules).

We can keep arguing the point, but Ike suffers from laggy attacks. This means that when it comes to mindgames and landing attacks he has less opportunities to mix it up and therefore land anything.

Not a great comparison, but even Bowser, Snake, Dedede, and Ganondorf have some quick attacks in their arsenal.

EDIT: Oh, by the way, I found some breakdown on Stale Moves. Tadah:

Attack Power Decay
This game "punishes" the repeated use of the same attack by decreasing BOTH the DAMAGE and KNOCKBACK a move does.

Attack Queue
The game keeps track of this by having an "Attack Queue" where it remembers the last 9 (although it may be 10 -- best I can tell it's only 9 though) attacks that you landed on your opponent. If your attacks are getting weaker than you would like, just hit with several other attacks, and then your other moves will soon be back to full strength.

Decay Amount
A move has a base damage and Knockback. It then counts the number of times that move is in the attack queue, and has an exponential decay that it applies to the strength. The current formula I have found seems to be pretty accurate:
damage dealt = [94.424e^(-0.0991x)] * (base damage)
where x is the # of times that move is in the attack queue.

The earlier in the queue this attack is, the less it impacts the decay, although the earliest it can be in the queue makes less than a 10% difference than if it were the last attack landed.

So, yeah, it starts to affect after the second one albeit just a little bit. It also depends on what attacks hit.

[mudah.swf]

It's not like those items can't be dodged in any way. the pitfall maybe.

[Loyal]

They've yet to provide actual, "tested thoroughly" reasoning for their specific rules. To explain:

First game of a match to be played on Evo Custom Map. Players can decide to play on any map, if both players agree.

Why? Why not simply choose any of the numerous neutral stages we already have, like Battlefield, Smashville, or god forbid, Final Destination? These stages are revered by the competitive community because they are (with the exception of a few kinks on FD) good stages.

Losing player can pick a new stage or new character, not both.

The rules behind counterpicking are somewhat complicated and a bit of a metagame in and of themselves. And so I'll simply quote someone on SWF.

Originally Posted by SWF'er

The counterpick(HA!) system is just that, a complete joke. There is no counterpicking in that system. With a game as heavily dependant on character match-ups as Brawl, there is no room for error in counterpicking.
So you're telling me if I'm Ganondorf vs Dedede first round and get chaingrabbed to hell and back first round, its either stick with Ganon and change stages, which will do nothing to help me, or go Luigi and let Dedede select Shadow Moses and still own me? Or go random and hope that luck is with me that day? (Either way, I'm very likely screwed completely over)

Moving on.

2 Stock, 3 Min timer, 3/5 Games

Not nearly enough time. The reason Brawl tournies began to move from 4 stocks to 3 stocks is because it simply took too long to kill people. When the tournament matches move to higher level play, it will take more than three minutes to finish most matches. And from there we move to...

Sudden Death will decide the outcome of the game.

...this horrible idea. Sudden Death isn't so much the Great Equalizer of Smash Bros as much as an enforced way of saying "This has gone on long enough. Will one of you bastards just win already?" A single hit from damn near any attack is a guaranteed win here, and does not begin to take into account stuff like how close the match was BEFORE SD, or how some characters have a head-and-shoulders advantage over everybody else in such a situation (the speedy characters, mostly).

Allowed Items: Banana Peel, Unira, Spring, Mr. Saturn, Green Shell, Smoke Ball, Freezie, Super Scope, Sandbag, Food, Screw Attack, Warp Star, Metal Box, Bunny Hood, Beam Sword, This thing has hideously logn range as a battering weapon. Baseball Bat, Even if you THROW it the knockback is insane. Lip's Stick, Star Rod, It's a battering item, projectile weapon, and powerful spike all in one! Hothead, Smash Ball, Some characters have too easy a time getting ahold of it, and some characters simply have too powerful a Final Smash. Ray Gun, It is entirely possible, even in Brawl, to chain-shot someone with this to a guaranteed KO. Pitfall, Free FSmash, or a thrown Meteor that would make Donkey Kong weep? You decide. Cracker Launcher, Too damn powerful. I don't even know where to begin with this. Motion-Sensor Bomb, Hammer, Golden Hammer, This and the regular hammer basically equals invulnerability vs. anyone without a projectile. Bumper, Hideous knockback even at low percentages. Blast Box, Considering that the cardinal reason for banning Items in Melee was that one of these suckers could drop in on you in the middle of an attack, I don't even want to know how they came to the conclusion that this was a good idea. Franklin Badge.

I'm not going to put quote tags for every single one of these things, so those I have a comment on have the comment in red.

I'm not even going to start on their list of banned stages (or rather, which things belong there but aren't, and why the hell is Norfair on there?)

[Mirai Gen]

Yeah this had better be "Evo Fools!" or something because I don't see competitors going to this tournament at all.