Abortion: A Choice, Not Chore - Page 7

AntiGnostic · 07-15-2004, 01:03 PM

I've said what I see to be true. I do not comprimise truth. If that is a crime, then I am guilty.

Also...

Quote:

I'm really interested in you for one simple reason. The dictionary definition of gnostic is "of, relating to, or possessing intellectual or spiritual knowledge"... so does that mean you are against intellectual and/or spiritual knowledge?

No, that is a reference to the Gnostic cults that have been around since the BC days. But to get into that would be a theological discussion, which is forbidden (around here, at least).

Anyway, I've said all I can say on this matter.

-AntiGnostic (home of the original 'defender' tagline)

Krylo · 07-15-2004, 05:05 PM

I'm sticking by my "Is my finger a human" question. If my finger isn't a human, then how is a small mass of cells that doesn't have a brain, fingers, lungs, a heart, or any other organs? The brain being most notable, as that it's the thing that makes a human different from a monkey... well, that and the notable lack of body hair and tails (usually).

Obviously my finger is 'human'. Much like a fetus is human. But being human doesn't make something A human. There's human hair. Human fingernails. A human is more than just a couple of cells feeding off the wall of uteral lining.

AND, yes, Mepersoner did miss the point. I was asking why stopping the potential for life one way is any worse than doing it another way.

KefkaTaran · 07-15-2004, 06:37 PM

Archbio: See, you get what I mean though. Truth be told, as silly as it might seem, there are DIFFERENT definitions for what a 'human' is in terms of science and in terms of philosophy. And if sentience is a part of being a human, then what about people who are retarded, for lack of a better word. It can be argued that they lack sentience... then again it could be argued that they don't also.

Also: I forgot about the gnostic cult portion! My bad, on that one. I prefer the other definition of gnostic, though.

Most importantly: He's guilty! GET HIM!

Archbio · 07-15-2004, 06:51 PM

There are some definitions, but I prefer another word than human for a concept beyond just human as a species (either individuals or mass of tissues) since using human to denote a state like this binds both concepts together too much when they don't have to be.

On the other hand, I really like the "something human" or "a human" distinction.

Missing a point can be easy when trying.

mepersoner · 07-15-2004, 07:37 PM

Your finger willl never grow into a human being. You obviously completely ignored my post on what defines a human being.

I didn't miss the point, everyone else missed the point of the analogy, obviously. It's stopping the potential for life just like an abortion, by taking something that is already human and killing it.

A sperm will never grow into a human being. An egg will never grow into a human being. An egg and sperm coming together will.

Edit: And whoever said wearing a condom is like commiting mass murder is absolutely out of their mind. How many eggs do the sperm have to impregnate at any given time? Alright then.

Archbio · 07-15-2004, 07:44 PM

Eh, that's because the analogy doesn't work. The very point of something like

Quote:

wearing a condom is like commiting mass murder

was to show how ridiculous the "destroying potential" thing is.

The gametes would grow if they came together, so when you don't do all you can to get them together, you are wasting all these half-persons, and thus destroying all of the full persons they could grow into. That's what I meant, anyway.

If being human is just the right number of chromosomes...

Mashirosen · 07-15-2004, 08:16 PM

Closing for length, feel free to start another if you feel like it.

07-15-2004, 05:05 PM	#62
Krylo The Straightest Shota Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: It's a secret to everybody. Posts: 17,789	I'm sticking by my "Is my finger a human" question. If my finger isn't a human, then how is a small mass of cells that doesn't have a brain, fingers, lungs, a heart, or any other organs? The brain being most notable, as that it's the thing that makes a human different from a monkey... well, that and the notable lack of body hair and tails (usually). Obviously my finger is 'human'. Much like a fetus is human. But being human doesn't make something A human. There's human hair. Human fingernails. A human is more than just a couple of cells feeding off the wall of uteral lining. AND, yes, Mepersoner did miss the point. I was asking why stopping the potential for life one way is any worse than doing it another way. __________________ I am very tired. Last edited by Krylo; 07-15-2004 at 06:53 PM.

07-15-2004, 06:37 PM	#63
KefkaTaran Magikoopa Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,545	Archbio: See, you get what I mean though. Truth be told, as silly as it might seem, there are DIFFERENT definitions for what a 'human' is in terms of science and in terms of philosophy. And if sentience is a part of being a human, then what about people who are retarded, for lack of a better word. It can be argued that they lack sentience... then again it could be argued that they don't also. Also: I forgot about the gnostic cult portion! My bad, on that one. I prefer the other definition of gnostic, though. Most importantly: He's guilty! GET HIM! __________________ So break, my heart, for I must hold my tongue.

07-15-2004, 08:16 PM	#67
Mashirosen Watch closely! Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Imaginary tomorrowland Posts: 1,855	Closing for length, feel free to start another if you feel like it. __________________ "Remember how we all thought the Jedi were, well, Space Knights of the Round Table? Well, as it turns out, they're a bunch of self-righteous virgins who kidnap kids to replenish their numbers."

07-15-2004, 06:51 PM	#64
Archbio Data is Turned On Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,980	There are some definitions, but I prefer another word than human for a concept beyond just human as a species (either individuals or mass of tissues) since using human to denote a state like this binds both concepts together too much when they don't have to be. On the other hand, I really like the "something human" or "a human" distinction. Missing a point can be easy when trying.

07-15-2004, 07:37 PM	#65
mepersoner Troopa Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 39	Your finger willl never grow into a human being. You obviously completely ignored my post on what defines a human being. I didn't miss the point, everyone else missed the point of the analogy, obviously. It's stopping the potential for life just like an abortion, by taking something that is already human and killing it. A sperm will never grow into a human being. An egg will never grow into a human being. An egg and sperm coming together will. Edit: And whoever said wearing a condom is like commiting mass murder is absolutely out of their mind. How many eggs do the sperm have to impregnate at any given time? Alright then.