Megaman Legends 3 Cancelled

[Kim]

SORRY GUYS (http://gamerlive.tv/article/capcom-cancels-megaman-legends-3)

I haven't even played Megaman Legends and I was interested in this.

ON THE BRIGHT SIDE I GET TO KEEP PUTTING OFF A 3DS

[EVILNess]

GODDAMNIT!

[rpgdemon]

I hate you Noncon, because you apologized, and I now hold you fully accountable.

[Kim]

That's two Megaman games cancelled in one year.

Apparently Sega also recently postponed a title because the 3DS doesn't have strong system sales.

[Solid Snake]

Apparently Sega also recently postponed a title because the 3DS doesn't have strong system sales.

According to Gamespot, Assassin's Creed Revelations was also originally planned to be a 3DS title (!!!) before the idea was scrapped.

All in all I'd say I'm actually kind of worried over how the 3DS is doing so far. This is Sony's best chance to take advantage.

[Kim]

Right now it's looking like Sony's gonna do so ballin' this handheld generation.

[akaSM]

Hey, you wrote the article you linked :P

Welp, I think the other game was Mega Man Universe (or something), I wonder what made them cancel this game too, I think many people were expecting it :/

If the 3DS isn't selling well, I would blame the lackluster launch titles and the high price tag. Really, when the 3DS launched, I could get a PS3 for the same price. Right now, a 3DS costs as much as 2 Wiis.

There's something wrong if the price of a portable console is 2x the same company's home console, even if it's a generation ahead.

[greed]

Right now it's looking like Sony's gonna do so ballin' this handheld generation.

Karma for Other M. Seriously. FUCK. NINTENDO.

[akaSM]

Karma for Other M. Seriously. FUCK. NINTENDO.

Karma for what? Stop talking about things that obviously don't exist.

So, could this mean that the 3DS will get a more reasonable price? I mean, I still want to wait for the 3DS lite with cameras that don't suck but, getting it cheaper would be nice.

[Donomni]

ON THE BRIGHT SIDE I GET TO KEEP PUTTING OFF A 3DS

SAME, FORK YOU SHORT BATTERY LIFE

Ugh, this is horrible news. If it really does turn out to be because the 3DS isn't doing as good as they thought, couldn't they kinda take what they made and fix it up for another platform?

I know that's not likely to be possible but damn this is sad.

[EVILNess]

I mean, I still want to wait for the 3DS lite with cameras that don't suck but, getting it cheaper would be nice.

THIS.

Maybe this will teach console makers to stop revising their damn consoles a year after launch, and to bring their A Game when they release the damn things.

I mean, recent history has taught me not to buy the first set of any handheld or console. The GBA had the SP remake, the DS had the Lite, the PSP had the Better and better 2000 and 3000. I guess you have to lump in the iPhone, with it's 4 different iterations. Why should I buy an inferior product when I can get a better made version for cheaper the Christmas after release of the original?

At least with the consoles they have the decency to be usually be hardware failures so that the companies replace your shit with new consoles due to warranty.

[Kim]

Honestly, I blame Nintendo for this much more than I do Capcom. I'm ticked, but can't get too mad at Capcom going, "Our stuff doesn't sell well on Nintendo consoles already, and this Nintendo console hasn't sold as well as Nintendo wanted. Time to cut our losses!"

[Grand Master Kickface]

So, Nintendo purposefully refrains from launching several first-party titles along with the 3DS in order to garner the support of third-party developers by offering less competition. Nobody buys the 3DS because of a lack of titles. Third-party developers decide to jump ship because nobody owns a 3DS.

I'd think this was hilarious if I wasn't livid with rage.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

I'm pissed but even more so because I KNEW this going to get canned. But it getting canned because the 3DS is not selling well enough!? That caught me off guard. It's a dark day for Nintendo... I'm too scared to even peak at what's happening over at Gamefaqs right now.

[Magus]

So, Nintendo purposefully refrains from launching several first-party titles along with the 3DS in order to garner the support of third-party developers by offering less competition. Nobody buys the 3DS because of a lack of titles. Third-party developers decide to jump ship because nobody owns a 3DS.

I'd think this was hilarious if I wasn't livid with rage.

Was that really their stated strategy? Did someone from Nintendo actually say that? 'Cause if so, Nintendo got some 'splainin' to do.

[Locke cole]

So, there are few high-quality games as of yet for the 3DS, leading to people not buying it, waiting until there are better games. Companies then see that there are low sales for the system, and scrap planned games for the system. Leading to consumers deciding then and there not to buy the system.

It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to see that that's a self-drilling hole with no bottom.

[Kim]

So, there are few high-quality games as of yet for the 3DS, leading to people not buying it, waiting until there are better games. Companies then see that there are low sales for the system, and scrap planned games for the system. Leading to consumers deciding then and there not to buy the system.

It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to see that that's a self-drilling hole with no bottom.

Pretty much. Hopefully Nintendo will reassess their strategy in regards to third party devs and stop cutting corners on their hardware. I can't say their current handling of the Wii has inspired any goodwill in their consumers, so it's definitely going to be harder for them to get gamers buying more 3DS on the assumption it will get better.

[Locke cole]

Currently, I'm planning to get it around Christmas or something; Kid Icarus and SSB4 have me still hooked, and I'm hoping it's just the same story as the DS in terms of initial library weakness.

As for Nintendo and 3rd parties, it seems that they are at least doing better in that respect on the Wii U, if their little "hey, look at all these 3rd parties announcing games" trailer at E3 was an indication.

[Kim]

It's much easier to get third parties to support your system when all they have to do is port games they're already making to it, which they couldn't really do with the Wii.

[Locke cole]

Yeah, I, at least, thought that was a major point of that trailer. It was them showing off, making it clear that they can get these kinds of developers now.

...Of course, I keep running into people going "oh, so it plays last-gen games.", when it seems to me that they were showing off those games mainly due to name recognition, rather than a demonstration of the system's full potential.

Anyway, this is all tangental. Like, if this train of thought were a line on a graph, It last touched the circle that is our main topic about 5 plot points ago and then rocketed off without regret.

[Solid Snake]

As for Nintendo and 3rd parties, it seems that they are at least doing better in that respect on the Wii U, if their little "hey, look at all these 3rd parties announcing games" trailer at E3 was an indication.

Do you remember the previous year's E3 and the gleeful insanity over the list of third-party support for the 3DS?
...Because I do.
I do. =/

[Locke cole]

That support still exists.

...it just happens to be moving very slowly.

I mean, as far as I know, MGS3 and Kingdom Hearts DDD haven't been cancelled, and neither have the games from the Tales and SMT crews.

Now, the difference is that we already know that some of the WiiU's 3rd party stuff is coming out early. To give an example, I distinctly remember Darksiders 2 being announced as a launch title.

[Kim]

The problem with the 3DS is that many of the games announced for it still haven't come out, and there haven't really been any worthwhile announcements since then.

[Locke cole]

Yes. I agree with you entirely on that. I am still hopeful, because there are still things on the way. This cancellation, though, is sad news, and I hope it's not going to be a growing trend. If it gets started, it could become quite the vicious cycle.

[Grand Master Kickface]

Was that really their stated strategy? Did someone from Nintendo actually say that? 'Cause if so, Nintendo got some 'splainin' to do.

These (http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34456/Iwata_Nintendo_To_Schedule_3DS_Game_Releases_To_Av oid_ThirdParty_Conflicts.php) are (http://www.siliconera.com/2011/05/02/super-mario-mario-kart-or-animal-crossing-coming-to-nintendo-3ds-this-fiscal-year/) the best I can do on short notice, although I could have sworn I read that specific strategy somewhere.

“We want the other companies to be successful,” Iwata said to investors. “In order to accomplish this goal, we would like to decide on the dates after we know the release plans of other companies’ games so that we are able to consider how we can maximize the sales of our titles without affecting the sales of other companies in the short term.”

[Professor Smarmiarty]

I'm not entirely sure why we want all the consoles to be similar in hardware enabling porting. I would push for them all to be radically different so that innovation comes to the forefront and new ideas can be tested and either succeed or fail. If you have three systems that are basically the same that doesn't help the industry progress.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Maybe this won't accomplish much or really anything at all but still... pass this around to as many different places as you can.

http://www.capcom-unity.com/classic_megaman/blog/2011/07/19/letter_to_capcom:_megaman_legends_3

[Locke cole]

I'm not entirely sure why we want all the consoles to be similar in hardware enabling porting. I would push for them all to be radically different so that innovation comes to the forefront and new ideas can be tested and either succeed or fail. If you have three systems that are basically the same that doesn't help the industry progress.

Ideally, I'd like 3 systems that have radically different capabilities, but which are sort of built around a common core of basic controls. Such that games can either exploit the extremely different parts of each system, such that it's extremely creative and restricted to one, or focus on being a great game that uses none of the extremely different parts, and as such can be ported between the 3.

[Kim]

On a more positive note, Gamecube games will be downloadable for the Wii-U, so fuck yeah!

[Aldurin]

I'm most likely not going to get the 3DS until I see enough games I want to play, otherwise it would take the spot on the shelf next to my DS (I hardly find any new DS games worthwhile lately, but maybe I just have high standards or that Nintendo allows hordes of crap to hide the good stuff.) With plenty of possible games like Megaman Legends 3 being pulled off of development, it's going to leave those crap games like Dog Sitter 3D or other bullshit Nintendo always allows to take most of the attention.

I may go for the next Sony handheld as long as the games from franchises I like aren't outsourced for it (the R & C games for PSP were horrible, so fuck you Sanzaru).

[akaSM]

On a more positive note, Gamecube games will be downloadable for the Wii-U, so fuck yeah!

YESS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs)

I just hope the WiiU isn't stupidly expensive; if the 3DS is as expensive as the PS3 is right now, I don't wanna know how much will the WiiU cost :ohdear:

I mean, I'm not only not getting a 3DS because of the lack of games or, "the 3DS lite will come next week" kind of things but, because it's so fucking expensive I don't think it's worth it.

[akaSM]

I hardly find any new DS games worthwhile lately

I've found good games, games I want to get but I just can't. Ghost Trick has been out for quite some time but, even though many people here have been able to play it, I haven't. I've been looking for the game everywhere, the biggest videogame stores don't have it, internet sites either don't have it, won't ship to Mexico or will make you pay more (a lot more) for shipping than the actual game.

AFAIK, the game got released in the US but, for some reason it's not being sold anywhere in Mexico :(

[Kim]

Last good games for the DS were Radiant Historia and Ghost Trick. Both are fantastic. Atlus is release Devil Survivor 2, which should also be fantastic, early 2012, I think. AFAIK it and Kirby will be the last good DS games.

[Solid Snake]

Last good games for the DS were Radiant Historia and Ghost Trick. Both are fantastic. Atlus is release Devil Survivor 2, which should also be fantastic, early 2012, I think. AFAIK it and Kirby will be the last good DS games.

As someone who was never really into Handheld gaming in earlier eras, the DS was the first handheld device with a lineup of games so juicy, graphics so stellar and controls so intuitive as to ensure a purchase.

...That's actually one reason why the 3DS has disappointed me so much. Its price point, lack of third party support and its 3D gimmickry wearing thin actually reminds me of how Sony slipped with the PS3 launch after dominating with the PS2. I wouldn't be surprised if later 3DS titles concentrated less on the 3D and more on just giving us graphically superior DS titles with DS gameplay.

[Locke cole]

Actually, the 3DS's lineup reminds me more of the DS, before devs really "got" the DS's gimmick and started using it well. I think it wasn't until Kirby Canvas Curse that I felt I had found a really good DS game.

As for MML3's cancellation, it really is our fault for not getting involved (http://www.themmnetwork.com/2011/07/20/capcom-europe-its-a-shame-the-fans-didnt-want-to-get-more-involved/). I mean, clearly.

[Kim]

Oh Jegus goddamn motherfuckery you dense motherfuckers Capcom.

Because we all know the number of fans who want to make your game is representative of how many would buy it.

[rpgdemon]

Ugh. These guys are, quite possibly, the most ill-informed developers ever.

Okay, so, when you're making game, you have to know that there will be three "tiers" of players: The hardcore players, the casual players, and the drive-bys, who will look, pop in once, and then just sort of leave.

Their dev room is a thing designed for the hardcore players. The hardcore players are the ones who actually go and find this, the casual ones probably pop in once and awhile, see what's going on, and the drive-bys go, "Hey, whatever happened to that new Megaman game in development, like, two years ago?", after it got cancelled because of lack of participation in the dev room.

The important thing is though, the hardcore players are the least numerous. In a group of 20 potential players, you can expect maybe 1-2 hardcore players. These are the players who live, eat, drink, and breathe Megaman Legends 3, and are intimately involved in everything to do with it. They make their own fan characters and villains, come up with gameplay elements to submit, and all those such things.

The casual players are the mass market, and as the dev room is not an attraction specifically for them, it can't give Capcom any idea of the actual mass market appeal.

[Locke cole]

The silver lining is him implying, towards the end, that the project could be revived if they see a strong enough reaction from the fans to prove them wrong.

[Loyal]

The news is sad and bewildering, and the response sounds like an excuse.

[Krylo]

In a group of 20 potential players, you can expect maybe 1-2 hardcore players.

I think you need to increase that first number exponentially and decrease the second one to a solid 1.

Unless it's a fighting game.

But it's not.

[Kerensky287]

I absolutely fucking hate it when devs blame the fans for a lukewarm response.

In this case:

1) The only people who see the "You guys didn't try hard enough" message are likely going to be the people who DID try hard enough, ie. people who follow news about Megaman Legends 3.

2) What the fuck were the Dev Rooms? I've never heard of them. I was a casual/"drive-by" fan of MML3, so all I knew about it was that it existed. If they wanted to get me and people like me involved, they should've put more of an effort out to LET PEOPLE KNOW. Poor marketing is to blame, not poor fan response.

3) If I understand correctly, the dev rooms were some method of introducing user-generated content or something similar. So... the argument they're making is that the game got cancelled because the people who were going to buy it didn't pitch in enough to help make it? What makes MML3 so special? Why should we have to sing harder for our supper?

[PyrosNine]

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4241108/sample_943fd22834c6c8732feecd3ccc17da17.png[/IMG]"]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4241108/sample_2bc8513bd84daef347353877a2c1a9c2.jpg

I was so shook up by the news that I have kept from posting, but only now do I have a proper way to convey my feelings on this subject via two relevant pictures.

[Solid Snake]

Hey guys we can all love Capcom again
Well at least I'm loving Capcom again
Because Phoenix Wright is totally going to be in the latest edition of their Marvel v. Capcom fighting game.

Which means I can kill superheroes.
AS PHOENIX WRIGHT.
Topic over.

[akaSM]

Image

I think Zero from MMZ should be with Mega Man Volsomething. I don't think the MMZ franchise had a proper ending, it even had offscreen deaths of important characters (similar to what happened the Chrono Trigger cast in Chrono Cross).

[PyrosNine]

Megaman Zero had a definitive ending, which therefore gives it the best ending out of all other Megaman endings, in that there ARE NONE. Except maybe Battle Network, but I got tired of that crap by the 4th one.

[Krylo]

Hey guys we can all love Capcom again
Well at least I'm loving Capcom again
Because Phoenix Wright is totally going to be in the latest edition of their Marvel v. Capcom fighting game.

Which means I can kill superheroes.
AS PHOENIX WRIGHT.
Topic over.

They're cancelling that too.

[akaSM]

the best ending out of all other Megaman endings, in that there ARE NONE

Touché.

I just watched the 4th game's ending again, well, it's certainly an ending but maybe I just wanted a happier ending, poor Ciel :/.

The Battle Network series had an ending too, I've only completely played the first 3 games and the 6th game. The 4th game didn't really get my attention and I didn't really like the 5th game's gameplay.

The original series just seems to keep going and going, they had an awesome opportunity to make the 10th game the link between the original and the X series.

The X series was supposed to end 3 games ago...

Star Force just doesn't get my attention.

Legends, I've only played the N64 version. At that time I didn't really like it but, that was because it's really different from the regular games. Maybe if I play it again, I'll enjoy it more.

ZX was a nice game, I loved having several characters in one, and being able to switch between them at any time.

Finally, the Zero series. freaking hard but so much fun. The ranks...I didn't like them, at all. Still, one of my favorite series ^_^.

[Kim]

Haha just realized that there's no Megaman in Ultimate MvC3 despite loads of lesser known characters getting in.

Nobody loves him :P

[Locke cole]

Zero seems to have become the go-to representative for the franchise.

And that's terrible.

[Kim]

Zero Legends!

[Locke cole]

I have no clue what tone that was in.

Granted, I kinda like Zero, especially when I learned that he was basically the first design for X, before Capcom went "Why does he look nothing like Mega Man?"

[Kim]

Tone was silly.

I like Zero, he's just less main character and more rival in my book, is all.

[akaSM]

Just wonderin', Why didn't they put Mega Man Volnutt in that game? They already used him in Tatsunoko VS Capcom.

Before someone says "It's a Wii model and will look shitty in HD", take a look at Morrigan's sprite in Capcom VS SNK 2 :P

[Locke cole]

So, apparently, it's possible to get this thing uncancelled. Maybe. And the action we can each take takes like 5 minutes tops, so there's very little reason not to try it. This guy explains the situation and gives instructions better than I can (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=unrbqlvxpm9ctx0amk46wp43&page=9#201), so just read that post and follow it.

[Kim]

So, apparently, it's possible to get this thing uncancelled. Maybe.

I don't really feel like the offer a really convincing argument for why this will get MML3 uncanceled, even assuming they could get enough people to do it in the first place.

[Meister]

I'm sure Capcom routinely base their business decisions on how many people someone can get to post in a forum thread.

Not really very comfortable with having "hey please blindly follow these instructions" posts here either, so I'm gonna ask that everyone do exactly the opposite of that. Inform yourself what exactly you're signing up for if anything, and make sure you want to be part of this, knowing that there's around a 100% chance it's nothing but someone's "it'll work when I get enough people to do it, right?" pipe dream.

e: like you're saying "it may be possible to get this uncancelled for just a few seconds of work" and the guy you link goes even further presenting it as fact that "you can uncancel this by signing here" when in reality, unless I'm truly gravely misunderstanding things, it's much more like "there's a thread where people want development to be picked up again, that's it, no Capcom representative actually ever came and said 'hell yes if 25000 of you sign this thing, development restarts that very day' or even 'we'll take it into account if we ever revisit the decision' and it's not implied anywhere and in fact wholly fabricated that this is how it works"

e2: Okay, turns out there was a thing on twitter more or less to that exact effect. Fair enough. Still don't personally think it's gonna do much but your mileage may vary.

[Jagos]

I think it's just time to let the game die. Inafune is gone, and MML3 seemed to be more his pet project than anything. With him gone, do we really want a lackluster game out that could possibly make APB or Duke Nukem look better than what Capcom puts together?

[Kim]

I honestly don't think Inafune is as special as people make him out to be. Capcom was putting out plenty of mediocre games when he was with the company. I don't think him leaving changes much.

[Jagos]

He was pretty influential in making new IP for Capcom.

Now that he's gone, I'm pretty sure all they're going to do for a while is fighting games. Meanwhile, Megaman might finally come to a conclusion and we can see how Wily and Light died to create Zero, destroy Bass, and kill Rock and Roll...

[Kim]

Hahaha...

Haha...

Ha...

That's not happening.

[Locke cole]

Wait, it was just a forum thing?

I'd been led to believe that it was Capcom's official Dev Room thing; whose membership numbers they had used as one of the reasons to candel the project in the first place.

...Was I wrong?

[Yumil]

The game wasn't even set to officially go out. They were using numbers based on the Dev Room plus participation in the Dev Room in account to cancelling them working on the prototype.

Basically, they decided to have fans help out with feedback as they built up the prototype as an experiment. It would be later decided whether or not the game would be released, but they were supposed to be working on something.

Anywho, due to extremely low turn out in the feedback(The tsunami probably didnt help either), they canned the whole experiment. Honestly, I had no idea that there was any kind of experiment going on or that they needed my input. I don't like the way capcoms community site is set up and dont go there often anyway. Right now the whole campaign going on is to show capcom they screwed up and there is interest in the community to actually participate in it. They didn't do the advertising they needed to in the first place and the cancellation notice has pretty much done all they needed to to garner interest.

It wouldn't hurt to still do the prototype. Besides, they'd still get plenty of goodwill from their fans if they do. They still dont have to green light the game for full production, but they did promise a prototype in the least.

[Jagos]

Totally relevant (http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/545)

[Meister]

It is Capcom's official dev room thing but why that would equal "enough posts here = development gets continued" escapes me.

[Locke cole]

Honestly? I was confused, too. I guess my thought process was "welp, couldn't hurt its chances, I guess", and there was that one twitter/blog/I don't even remember post from some guy in the company that was like "well, I'm not allowed to say either way, but..."

I dunno. I don't regeret adding another number to it. I guess, in posting it here, I was trying to accelerate it, on the off-chance that it does get something changed.

Perhaps I'm too optimistic, or place too low of a value on the time it took me to sign up, I dunno.

[Nikose Tyris]

http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=157963

Capcom notices fan response; still canned.

[Jagos]

Honestly, was anyone expecting differently?

[Kim]

Well yeah, just nobody with a grasp on reality.

[Sky Warrior Bob]

I don't blame Capcom for ignoring a petition. Serenity got made because of one & that wasn't the kind of success Fox was looking for.

A vote on a petition is a far cry from a guaranteed sale. So in other words, internets hugged itself with Serenity. Nobody cares about a petition since.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

DAMN IT CAPCOM!!!!! (http://www.gameblurb.net/news/capcom-refused-to-let-keiji-inafune-to-complete-mega-man-legends-3/)

[Meister]

Serious question from a guy who has never remotely come into contact with any Mega Man after X3: what was going to be so great about this one that the news of its cancellation elicit so strong a reaction?

[Kim]

Megaman Legends and Megaman Legends 2 had a cult following and did something new with the Megaman franchise without completely tripping over their shoelaces, from what I gather. Apparently the second game had a "sequel teaser" ending as well, meaning they've been expecting a game to tie this up for a while.

Just based on what I know.

[Magus]

Nothing of substance, since I don't believe there was anything released about the actual game or its plot or whatever, even possibilities, more just that some people were big fans of the first two so the possibility of a third was pretty exciting for them.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

And addition the fan base was teased with possiblities of a MML3 for almost a decade now.

The fans could only handle so much. As for me it's more of a from the prospective of "creator wanting to continue HIS work that unfortunately belongs to the Execs" kind of thing. And the thought that I might be faced with a similar problem someday.

Megaman Legends and Megaman Legends 2 had a cult following and did something new with the Megaman franchise without completely tripping over their shoelaces, from what I gather. Apparently the second game had a "sequel teaser" ending as well, meaning they've been expecting a game to tie this up for a while.

Just based on what I know.

This is all true as I own both games and have seen the ending for MML2.

[Donomni]

That's pretty much it. When a series with a notable fanbase has a hook for a sequel, and instead of actually getting said sequel the characters from that series get used in a dozen or so other games for a decade, and then you get something like what happened with MML3?

Yeah, people are gonna be pretty peeved.