Attention: Greed (Tales of Graces f Related)

[Solid Snake]

...So I spent money on three games today and returned home tonight to learn that a new jRPG has been released for the PS3 that appears to have traditional jRPG elements and has been positively reviewed (http://www.amazon.com/Tales-Graces-f-sony-playstation3/dp/B002I0K2J4/)

And so then I was like "How the fuck was I not informed of this development? I bought all these games that were not jRPGs! I've been dying for a solid PS3 jRPG!"

And Liz was like "Oh yeah Greed told me about it, he's playing it now."

And then I was like "But...but I already opened my new games...and if I was told about this...I, I would have..."

GREED
I BLAME YOU
YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS GRAVE ERROR

...Seriously, though: Is it any good?
Apparently Rise is voicing a character?
Apparently the battle sequences are incredibly frantic?

Is it like
Is it like everything I yearn for
Everything I imagine we've now lost
When I hear the word jRPG and my heart erodes to figments of dust
Will this game be what restores it to its former glory

[CABAL49]

As a general rule, I distrust Australians.

[greed]

Yes Snake it is an excellent JRPG, characters are a bit generic but better than average for JRPGs these days and the battle system is fucking amazing.

Also like no loading times at all which is just a nice thing.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Snake, you need to get this game. I just randomly got it from my uncle as a gift. It's awesome and you need to exprience this.

[Regulus Tera]

Battle system is great, the story is just another Tales game with some twists here and there.

Stop playing jRPGs for the plot and you will enjoy them just fine.

[Solid Snake]

Battle system is great, the story is just another Tales game with some twists here and there.

Having never played a Tales game before, this statement has absolutely no bearing on my decision to purchase it or not.
Y'all stink at game recommendations! Or maybe I just miss Liz's tack of "Snake, let me discuss with you for the next fifteen minutes exactly why this game is like custom-designed sex tailored just for your personal fetishes, only better" approach.

[Ecks]

I have a friend who plays games for the plot.

I feel sorry for that guy. He's missing out on so much fun and playing way too much shit.

[Ryong]

Snake, can you play Tales of Destiny 2 ( PSX )/ Tales of Eternia ( PSP remake )?

Tales of Legendia ( PS2 ) also has probably the best plot of the series, but people will disagree heavily 'cause the battle system is still 2D.

[Kim]

I tried to play Tales of Legendia and couldn't stop screaming cuz I had no idea what I was doing combat-wise cuz there was no tutorial. Graphics are also pretty shit. That said, I've still got it so I'll probably go back to trying to play it later.

I'll hopefully be getting Tales of Graces later. Hoping to finish Devil Survivor 2 later today then trade it and some other games in.

[Ryong]

I'm now trying to remember what Tales game ever had a tutorial, honestly.

Abyss also never told you how the magic circles worked, which was weird as it was an important mechanic.

[Kim]

Symphonia had a tutorial. I think Vesperia explains its combat a bit, too. I guess a tutorial just felt more necessary in Legendia cuz everything about the combat caught me off-guard.

[Regulus Tera]

Having never played a Tales game before, this statement has absolutely no bearing on my decision to purchase it or not.
Y'all stink at game recommendations! Or maybe I just miss Liz's tack of "Snake, let me discuss with you for the next fifteen minutes exactly why this game is like custom-designed sex tailored just for your personal fetishes, only better" approach.
It's a great Tales of game to start with if you are a newb to the series, all I'm saying is that you shouldn't play jRPGs video games for their story-telling purposes even if there are some exceptions to the rule.

[Kim]

This twin-tails girl is basically a Nagato.

[greed]

Snake, can you play Tales of Destiny 2 ( PSX )/ Tales of Eternia ( PSP remake )?

Tales of Legendia ( PS2 ) also has probably the best plot of the series, but people will disagree heavily 'cause the battle system is still 2D.

What the fuck man? Vesperia is the only Tales game where the writing passes mediocre.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

I have to agree with greed on this one.

[greed]

This twin-tails girl is basically a Nagato.

A Nagato with moments of incredible bad anime protagonist like moments of stupidity, friendship obssession and bull headed "fuck shit up"ness.


Also yeah the main things to recommend it for I covered, combat is amazing, it looks nice and plays smoothly and there's a fair bit of humour in there. Just be warned the plot is at times really realllly dumb.

[Solid Snake]

A Nagato with moments of incredible bad anime protagonist like moments of stupidity, friendship obssession and bull headed "fuck shit up"ness.


Also yeah the main things to recommend it for I covered, combat is amazing, it looks nice and plays smoothly and there's a fair bit of humour in there. Just be warned the plot is at times really realllly dumb.

But Nagato girl is Rise Kujikawa, right?
...Well one of the girls is Rise.
And really, that's all I care about! She can be a terrible character, so long as I can close my eyes and imagine it's Rise.

Even the awful anime could not destroy my rabid P4 fanboyism
Also Liz just convinced me yesterday to purchase Tales of Graces so now is not the time to talk about how the story's awful

[Kim]

But Nagato girl is Rise Kujikawa, right?
...Well one of the girls is Rise.
And really, that's all I care about! She can be a terrible character, so long as I can close my eyes and imagine it's Rise.

Even the awful anime could not destroy my rabid P4 fanboyism
Also Liz just convinced me yesterday to purchase Tales of Graces so now is not the time to talk about how the story's awful

Nah, Nagato is another character. Sort of an evolution of the Rei Ayanami character type. You probably won't mind how tropy it is as much as greed or I do, as you're not as familiar with the tropes. That said, it's not bad at all so far.

EDIT: Unrelated, Snake, but if you don't buy Atelier Meruru in May, Greed and I will judge you.

[Solid Snake]

EDIT: Unrelated, Snake, but if you don't buy Atelier Meruru in May, Greed and I will judge you.

What is Atelier Meruru?

EDIT: Oh shit apparently it's a trilogy and two of the games were already released in North America.
Fuck I have no time to start a whole new RPG trilogy.

[Kim]

What is Atelier Meruru?

EDIT: Oh shit apparently it's a trilogy and two of the games were already released in North America.
Fuck I have no time to start a whole new RPG trilogy.

It is a game about a princess learning the secrets of alchemy and setting off on adventures to expand and better her small kingdom of Arls. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wb5O_xvUHm4)

Here is the OP to it. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xy9o7GFoWf0)

It's the third Atelier game set in Arland, and based on reviews it is the best one thus far. You don't have to play the first two to play it. I never finished the first one due to a busy schedule, and I still had a great time with the second. There's actually a trailer online for Meruru that sums up the events of the first two games quite well.

EDIT: Here's the summary trailer. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkDrq8Y_9n0)

[Solid Snake]

You've forgotten how much of a completionist I am, Liz.
And uuuugggghhhh I don't have the money or the time for this

Simple explanation as to why I probably won't be purchasing this in May is because this Summer is Bar Review time, AKA two months of absolute hell, and a new RPG trilogy will have to wait.
...I might pick it up in the fall though

Also an RPG series with a female protagonist and story and art design clearly intended to appeal to a primary audience of women gamers?
IMPOSSIBLE
(Mind you I really do like the art style, it's nice to see something different in games)

[Kim]

Asbel x Richard FOREVER

EDIT: I just got Pascal and now all my life is screaming.

EDIT2: ROYAL CRABLETS ROYAL CRABLETS ROYAL CRABLETS

EDIT3: "Pascal gained the Hipster title" yessssss

[greed]

Asbel x Richard FOREVER



Yeah on this make sure you search Grayleside for skits, there's one you won't want to miss.


Also yeah I loved the Royal Crablettes and Hipster title as well.

[Kim]

On the one hand, good on Namco for including a lesbian two games in a row. On the other hand, Rita was a much better example of lesbian representation.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Your talking about Pascal, Liz? Yeah she's a bit... annoyingly hyper.

[Kim]

Nagato has grown on me a LOT for her post-battle banter alone. Protag and Love Interest are still kinda meh, but the character interaction is great and the dialogue is just aces most of the time. I am loving this game to death.

[Solid Snake]

Nagato has grown on me a LOT for her post-battle banter alone. Protag and Love Interest are still kinda meh, but the character interaction is great and the dialogue is just aces most of the time. I am loving this game to death.

Aww man
Maybe WRPGs have spoiled me but if there's one thing about them that I do prefer over jRPGs it's the ability to choose your own love interest
Whenever a jRPG forces a love interest on the Protag, I inevitably dislike the love interest more just because it's coerced, and I inevitably find myself wishing the Protag were with that Other Supporting Guy/Gal who's infinitely better in every way.

See: Cloud (preferred him with Aeris), Squall (should have been with Quistis), Zidane (Beatrix was so much more awesome; but I'll concede he and Dagger had nice moments too), Tidus (Rikku), P4 Protag (LET ME PURSUE KANJI DAMMIT), Fei (Citan or Bart >> Elly), etc.

[Kim]

Aww man
Maybe WRPGs have spoiled me but if there's one thing about them that I do prefer over jRPGs it's the ability to choose your own love interest
Whenever a jRPG forces a love interest on the Protag, I inevitably dislike the love interest more just because it's coerced, and I inevitably find myself wishing the Protag were with that Other Supporting Guy/Gal who's infinitely better in every way.

Fair, though in the game's defense there is an alternate ship. While that ship is currently full of more holes than a bullet-riddled block of swiss cheese, it's still sailing onward and the game actually acknowledges the relationship.

Rikku

This is a bad opinion and you should feel bad.

[greed]

Lulu, come on Snake. Also I prefer the JRPG style because they usually are far less involved and come off less creepy and nerd fantasy fulfillment as Western RPG romances do. Admittedly a big part of this is that JRPG leads are their own character whereas WRPG leads tend to be a player insert.

[Solid Snake]

This is a bad opinion and you should feel bad.

Shut the fuck up, Tidus and Rikku together would be hawt stuff.
...Or probably I just personally found Rikku the least dislikable of a fairly terrible female cast in FFX. Maybe that.

EDIT: Also I love how greed's explanation indirectly asserts that I prefer the wRPG format because I'm so lonely and miserable and forever alone that I need to imagine myself in some relationship with...
...Shit, that theory's surprisingly accurate. =/

[EVILNess]

Shut the fuck up, Tidus and Rikku together would be hawt stuff.


YUNA X RIKKU FOR EVERS.

[Solid Snake]

YUNA X RIKKU FOR EVERS.

Oh shit not another one of those FFX-2 fanboys
I'm pretty sure a handful of my very first posts on this message board were me bitching incessantly about FFX-2

[Ryong]

FFX-2 has some totally great mechanics - faster classes not only take less time to have the ATB fill, they also have smaller ATBs for most things, ability learning system is awesome - but uggggggh - keep changing classes so that you can get buffs, for example.

[Kim]

For all its dumb, X-2 at least has the decency to develop Yuna into a worthwhile character, and her characterization is consistent with her known experiences and those she chooses to involve herself with.

[Kim]

For a second, I was starting to think that Pascal had Rikku's voice actress, but I was wrong. The character type is just so similar they voice act the same way.

[Solid Snake]

Hey 'sup guyz startin' my Tales of Graces f playthrough up in this hizzy

Opening intro clearly establishes that redhead main character totally has the hots for this long-haired blonde guy
There's this moment where they're standing near a tree or some shit, and blondie's like "Let me walk by you, in dramatic slow-mo."
And main character's like "Let my gaze slowly follow you, in slow-mo."
JUST KISS ALREADY

[Ecks]

no man that's way too slow they should be on their way to their first babby already.

[Ryong]

Hey 'sup guyz startin' my Tales of Graces f playthrough up in this hizzy

Opening intro clearly establishes that redhead main character totally has the hots for this long-haired blonde guy
There's this moment where they're standing near a tree or some shit, and blondie's like "Let me walk by you, in dramatic slow-mo."
And main character's like "Let my gaze slowly follow you, in slow-mo."
JUST KISS ALREADY

So, this anything how Abyss' Luke is a complete whiny rich kid who thinks Guy is crazy awesome in all of the ways?

[EVILNess]

So... I picked up Tales of Graces f*. I haven't played enough to really form more than a cursory appraisal (I am at the part where Asbel proclaims he will keep Sophie like a pet until she gets her memory back.)

I will say this:

Skits = Awesome. Finally, Fully Voiced Skits! I have been waiting since Symphonia for these! The skit where Sophie pinched the other girl's face had me rolling for some reason.

Not entirely sold on the CP system versus TP, but it may be because I am not that far into the game. I am guessing your options are limited as a child (At least I HOPE that is how it is. Please don't let it stay that way...)

Voice acting is what I have come to expect. No complaints there, other than the standard same 5 people are in every game arguments.

I am hoping for a protagonist as interesting as Luke was**, but it seems like Asbel is going to be a Power of Friendship kind of guy right from the start. Honestly, this entire game is ramping up to be a clichestorm. Not entirely a bad thing, as it's been a while since I played one of those.

*Along with Disgaea 4, which was surprisingly hard for me to get, for some odd reason.
**Say what you want about Luke being an insufferable asshole, granted he was, he was functionally, and literally, 7 years old. Not to mention all of the shit the other characters gave him was unnecessary at best and downright cruel at worst. Also, Luke is the only one to ever admit any kind of real responsibility for his actions during the course of the game. Honestly, thinking back the Abyss cast was cruelest bunch of characters I have ever seen in a game.

[greed]

The new system gets really good once you get the customisation options going yeah. I prefer it greatly to the TP system. With the right build combat looks like something out of a SNK fighting game. Change characters around a bit too, Sophie is really fun to play as in the adult arc and she can be a nice change up from Asbel as they control quite differently.

And yeah it's a cliche storm, but somewhat forgivable as it's the counterpart to Tales of Vesperia which spent the whole game tearing apart cliches. I mean the lead in that was an ultra cynical, war veteran and vigilante murderer who fell for none of the normal JRPG garbage. So playing this after Vesperia is kinda refreshing.

Edit:Vesperia also had voiced skits.

[Kim]

Been working on the bonus chapter. As for the main story, so much of this game's story would have worked better had the voice acting been any good. Elsewhere, I described the VA work in this game as inoffensively terrible. It's not bad in a way that hurts to hear, but much of the cast is subpar at best and it really hurts the delivery of the more serious stuff.

In less whining about the game stuff, god there is so much fucking content Jesus Christ.

Also: I have cooked every meal in the game. I am the greatest.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Well I just beat emeruade and can now travel where ever I want with the shuttle. I think I'm at the end now. So this is as good a time as any for me to explore that other amercian dungeon in strahta as well as fight the rockagong and grind my way to level 70.



EDIT: So I fought the rockagong. For those who don't already know, he's LV160 and is more then able to 1-hit KO your entire party just by stepping on you. You cannot use any mystic artes on him and you must beat him within 20 minutes. His HP is 400,000 but he's rather slow and easy to dodge most of the time.

He's just like the Weapon Bosses from FFVII. While you can fight him very early in the game you're no where near a match for him till you reach his LV and stats (which are all over 1500+). Still he's pretty fun if you love fighting freakishly huge bosses. He takes up the entire screen! XD

[Kim]

I've finally hit that point in Tales of Graces where I accept that I am done with the game. I haven't killed the Rockgagong, finished the Master Class of the Coliseum, and there are still six floors left of Zhonecage, but I'm just... done. I don't really want to play the game anymore. I got what I wanted out of it and I'm fine with that. I've set the game to easy and may try finishing up a few of these things tomorrow for the fuck of it, but otherwise I've had enough.

As for the bonus chapter, it's very... fanficky. It's all about canonizing the worst ships in the game, sinking the best ships in the game, and lots of nonsense about being one big happy family. Not that the main story was super amazing (It was a poor man's Final Fantasy VII), but the bonus chapter is a lot more meh. There just isn't the character development present to really keep it interesting.

All in all, if I were to tack some arbitrary score onto Graces, it'd probably be 7.5 out of 10. The gameplay is stellar, there's assloads of content, and the character writing is great, but the overarching plot isn't that good, the voice acting is terrible, and the graphics clearly haven't been improved from the Wii release.

[Solid Snake]

I've finally hit that point in Tales of Graces where I accept that I am done with the game. I haven't killed the Rockgagong, finished the Master Class of the Coliseum, and there are still six floors left of Zhonecage, but I'm just... done. I don't really want to play the game anymore. I got what I wanted out of it and I'm fine with that. I've set the game to easy and may try finishing up a few of these things tomorrow for the fuck of it, but otherwise I've had enough.

As for the bonus chapter, it's very... fanficky. It's all about canonizing the worst ships in the game, sinking the best ships in the game, and lots of nonsense about being one big happy family. Not that the main story was super amazing (It was a poor man's Final Fantasy VII), but the bonus chapter is a lot more meh. There just isn't the character development present to really keep it interesting.

All in all, if I were to tack some arbitrary score onto Graces, it'd probably be 7.5 out of 10. The gameplay is stellar, there's assloads of content, and the character writing is great, but the overarching plot isn't that good, the voice acting is terrible, and the graphics clearly haven't been improved from the Wii release.

So long as Pascal remains a lovable lesbian in the the Epilogue (which I'm nowhere near but you can spoil that much without me losing my shit over it) I'll live with them making Asbel and Cheria canon.

And at this rate I can't possibly imagine them contradicting that. I mean for heaven's sake, the first interactions Pascal has with Sophie and (to a lesser but still notable extent) Cheria are filled with so much subtext that even Richard / Asbel pales by comparison.

...And Richard / Asbel has a boatload of evidence in the main story. I was so pleasantly surprised when the writers even had Asbel find an old letter Richard wrote to him and Cheria pretty explicitly says "He cares (about Asbel) just like I do," and there's really no possible way to interpret that non-romantically given her canon crush.

As for me I've been having fun with Graces.
I can't remember a ship I've been so thoroughly behind in recent history as much as Asbel / Richard. The fact that it's a yaoi ship and the yaoi-ness of it all doesn't even faze me is something I've interpreted positively as a sign of my budding progressivism. The fact that I've increasingly just found myself shouting at Asbel and Richard to kiss each other every time they're on screen together, on the other hand, is probably a mildly disturbing sign of Homestuck level shipping madness.

I'm probably not as big of a critic of the VA work as Liz is. In my mind, the talented Laura Bailey was horribly miscast as Cheria. And Asbel and Richard are undeniably awfully voice-acted, which ironically just makes them all much adorably awkward as a couple!
...But I like Hubert, Sophie and Pascal's VA work well enough, which means Graces is really just about as hit-and-miss as FFX was.

Gameplay is aces now that I actually know what the hell I'm doing, though admittingly I've really only mained as Asbel and Sophie and at this juncture I couldn't play as anyone else for shit.

I also like the replacement of the World Map with runnin' around roads.
Finally, from a story perspective it's impressive how Asbel has been deconstructed and how he just doesn't quite follow the same trajectory as other beloved jRPG protagonists. Unlike other Protags he actually suffers the consequences of his bad decisions and is called out by his allies when he fucks up.
I mean I guess Sophie is a bit too attached to Asbel to objectively criticize him, so that detracts a bit. But my two favorite moments so far were both moments where traditional supporting characters would've been like "Oh, that's okay, we love you Cloud" and these supporting characters laid the smackdown. When Hubert laid the smackdown on Asbel, it was just delicious. And when Asbel completely lost his mind on Cheria for no discernible reason, everyone else was like "What the fuck are you talking about?"

...Yeah I do like the fact that even though this story is following a lot of the standard "perfect protagonist, friendship is magic" cliches, Asbel ends up rightfully skewered and upstaged when he deserves to be skewered and upstaged.

...It saddens me that I'll really have cut down on playing it shortly, it will be missed.

ALSO MODS LOOK SNAKE CAN'T RESTRAIN HIMSELF
HE IS LIKE A FIVE YEAR OLD CHILD AND NPF IS HIS SUGAR-COATED CANDY
YOU NEED TO TAKE IMMEDIATE ACTION

[Kyanbu The Legend]

I'm gonna miss playing this game when I finish it.

I really hope Namco gives us Tales of Utena(sp?), even though I've heard it was a pretty medicore game.

[Fenris]

Snake, shouldn't you be studying?

Like, if you can't control yourself enough to keep yourself away from NPF long enough to study for your test, I sincerely question your ability to focus on your future court cases in which you will literally be responsible for the lives and livelihoods of your clients.

[synkr0nized]

Snake, if you can't handle your own free time/Internet use on your own, you'll just have to get banned the old-fashioned way. And that would be a shame, as then you'd not be able to come back.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Okay from now on lets try to make this a Tales of thread for all games in the series.


Also Tales of Xillia may have been green lit for an over seas release to the US and EU.
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/03/26/tales-of-xillia-trademarked-in-the-u-s.aspx

Personally I'm a little excited about this after playing Graces f. Though I've heard that it's pretty mediocre compared to Graces f and Vespara (PS3). Then again I heard that from the guys over at gamefaqs forum so...

EDIT: Also I best Graces f. Turns out that level 63 is more then enough to kill the final boss. XD I haven't played the bonus chapter yet though.