That's XCOM, baby! Once more!

[Loyal]

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After a rather transparent teaser/ARG over the last week via www.adventfuture.org, XCOM 2's been officially announced, slated to be released this November. It's set to be a PC exclusive this time around, so hopefully with their resources focused it'll be a liiittle more stable than Enemy Unknown.

So far we're looking at a new fifth class, what looks like Arc Thrower drones, Snakemen (or should I say, women?) shedding their Thin Men disguises, honest-to-god common melee weaponry for the player, and procedurally generated maps so we don't keep running into that one construction site with the pit in the middle, or that long highway with three pieces of usable cover, over and over again.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

edit: read the premise on the website, my suspicion on aliens pushing earth's shit in was validated. Gonna kick some alien overlord's naughty place in once again!

Kinda reminds me a little of xcom apocalypse but much less retro-futurism.

[Aerozord]

I could go for some more xcom, plus this might spring up a DLC sale and I've been eying it for awhile now

[Loyal]

Yeah, the website's not totally clear on what happened, but either EU's playable campaign was a failure, which would be fitting for XCOM... or we did succeed in pushing them back, only for the aliens to come back in overwhelming force with, say, more than one Temple Ship.

Like Shen says, if they were truly intent on conquering us, there's not much we could do to stop them.

plus this might spring up a DLC sale and I've been eying it for awhile nowFunny you should mention that. (http://store.steampowered.com/app/200510/)

[Aerozord]

Funny you should mention that. (http://store.steampowered.com/app/200510/)

hmm, if I get the package deal but already have the core game can I get a code to gift it to someone? Just the package is about the same price as getting the DLC I dont have

[Arcanum]

You could try buying it as a gift and hope it adds each individual thing to your inventory instead of a single bundle item.

Otherwise no you won't get a key 'cause Steam doesn't give keys for duplicate games when buying a bundle.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Private Soldierman has 97% chance to hit with sword. Private Soldierman has missed.

gettin those xcom flashbacks already.

[Solid Snake]

So is that city in the beginning some sort of territory controlled by the aliens where humans have been herded to live or something?

[Loyal]

The aliens, using the ADVENT Administration as a front, have built a number of seemingly utopian cities. They promise safety and security to all, and gene-therapy treatments for nearly any disease imaginable, both physical and mental. People live in these cities, and it seems to be a propaganda machine to get people to think that life under alien rule is actually a good thing.

If XCOM is correct, the cities are also used as staging grounds for some insidious, yet-to-be-specified experimentation on humanity. The human-Sectoid hybrid in the trailer gives a decent idea of what's going on there. And perhaps, instead of being a nod to the old Thin Men and XCOM games as we would first think, the Viper snakewomen (http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2015/06/XCOM2_Viper.jpg) are also at least partially a byproduct of this experimentation, seeing how they're far closer to terrestrial life than any other creature in the Aliens' employ. and have boobs

[Solid Snake]

The aliens, using the ADVENT Administration as a front, have built a number of seemingly utopian cities. They promise safety and security to all, and gene-therapy treatments for nearly any disease imaginable, both physical and mental. People live in these cities, and it seems to be a propaganda machine to get people to think that life under alien rule is actually a good thing.

...Yeah, this is where they lose me.


I haven't beaten XCOM, but so far in Enemy Unknown the entire point of the game is "Aliens don't even bother talking with us before deciding to completely eradicate us off the face of everything, completely destroy major population centers, kill everyone."

After killing millions upon millions if not billions of people, how could the aliens possibly convince humans they're allies?

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

I hope they learned a lesson from Enemy Unknown/Within and made it so laser weaponry wasn't such a useless resource dump. Sucked somethin fierce during the first playthrough to get into lasers only to have them rendered absolutely useless the moment plasma tech was researched.

Like, say, lasers were a moderate boost over default weapons but could be researched into having significantly higher crit when landing good targeted shots and/or accuracy over longer distances whereas plasma would have slightly shorter distance and damage dropoff beyond a certain point while having noticably high damage within optimal range.

That way investment in a tech wouldn't be negated by another.


After killing millions upon millions if not billions of people, how could the aliens possibly convince humans they're allies?

Ehhhh, civilian casualties by aliens weren't really nearly that high. Abductions for research was the prime modus operandi so mass slaughter was very counterproductive to their goal. That would cause them to get more than just XCOM's attention, because if one small paramilitary force could kick their asses that much and that often then getting entire large scale military forces aiming all sorts of shit at 'em would be even worse. In such a situation XCOM could just sit back and become an arms manufacturer for it all and let everyone else do the dirty work. As such, terror missions were always a last resort deal as a way of trying to force XCOM to stand down, plus cripple their funding as a side benefit, and let the aliens do their probing thang.

The population at large may have had an inkling of what was going on but as a whole they didn't realize just how large the expedition fleet, and in light of Xcom2 I'll call Unknown/Within's invasion an expedition fleet from henceforth, really was. XCOM is, as a whole, an independent para-military force flying under all sorts of radars. Be they media, goverment, etc. For as much suppression in combat occurs there's much more media suppression going on in the background. EW/EU kinda glosses over this but I think, and don't quote me on this since I haven't played XCOM or XCOM Terror from the deep in a longass time, in the earlier games if too many civilians died or you failed the mission in Terror Missions the media at large would report on alien sightings.

[Loyal]

Right, I forgot to mention. We didn't win Enemy Unknown. (http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/06/02/xcom-2-welcoming-our-new-alien-overlords) XCOM2 follows the idea that humanity was faced with overwhelming odds and sued for peace in a hurry. XCOM didn't even get as far as Laser weaponry, and probably never saw a single Terror mission. In other words, XCOM2 follows the 95% of campaign runs that sputtered out early on, (https://twitter.com/gsdeangelis/status/605806393484902400) instead of the very small percent of games that were seen through to completion and won decisively.

Hence, the takeover was relatively bloodless, at least in the public eye. And while I'm sure a number of people were miffed at the situation, a combination of utopian ADVENT cities and strategically "disappearing" certain dissidents has probably gone a long way to help people see the aliens as merely very aggressive benefactors instead of vile conquerors.

[Solid Snake]

...So, basically, this is the aftermath of all of Snake's XCOM games?

...Sure, I can roll with that.

[Aerozord]

Victory is really that low? I dont think I ever lost a campaign, do people jus give up when things get too harsh or suck at building up reserves?

Anyways, I do kind of agree the whole propaganda machine idea is kind of dumb. One thing I liked about xcom is they address the whole "if aliens really wanted us dead, we couldn't stop them." Now not in the best way, but they did atleast acknowledged it which I appreciate.

[Gregness]

Victory is really that low? I dont think I ever lost a campaign, do people jus give up when things get too harsh or suck at building up reserves?


The statistics don't surprise me. I think the first campaign I actually won was number 4 or 5, but part of that was me jumping immediately into Classic Ironman difficulty. I beat Ironman Impossible once out of at least a half-dozen tries.

[Loyal]

I pulled the numbers out of my ass, but it's safe to say that for every player who can beat the game, there are quite a few who can't, and that's without even considering the Classic/Impossible Ironman difficulty jumps.

[Solid Snake]

I pulled the numbers out of my ass, but it's safe to say that for every player who can beat the game, there are quite a few who can't, and that's without even considering the Classic/Impossible Ironman difficulty jumps.

Honestly, I have at least one playthrough on record that's far enough along and where I'm well enough established in terms of resources and sufficient countries are protected that I could see it through to the end, if I wanted to invest the time and effort into a lot of repetitive missions.

...The problem really stems from the fact that I force myself to play the game on a reasonable difficulty and with Squad permadeaths, I inevitably invest in my Squaddies, and then a couple of my favorites die horrific deaths, which kills my interest immediately.

Basically, I play XCOM too much as an RPG and not enough as a strategy game.

[Aerozord]

Biggest trick is to know your progress flags and pace yourself. Also rotate your squad alot. I pretty much always have a fresh recruit on a mission. Never focus too much on a small group

[Loyal]

SHIVs are nice to bring along. Even though they don't gain experience, they're good at drawing fire since they have a decent chunk of HP and use passive defense instead of cover. Strategic use of just one SHIV frees up the rest of your squad in a lot of ways.

Also, use explosives liberally to destroy cover, break line of sight often to fool the AI, and always have at least one person on the squad with good mobility ready to flank enemies.

[Karrrrrrrrrrrresche]

If I remember right MEC Troops were ridiculously strong for the investment for the early game if you have Enemy Within, and their upgrades just kept coming in strong.
The only downside was lost stat scaling or something.

Also thank fuck you can actually surprise the enemy now apparently. No more "Oops I stepped in to their line of sight and they immediately took perfect cover against me in a free turn."
None of that.

[Loyal]

Also true. Just their ability to destroy cover without using some once-a-mission thing makes them enormously valuable, but then they also get things like rocket boots, area-effect medikits, lots of grenades, and whatever they brought over from their base class. Plus they do tons of damage and have tons of health and are basically immortal in a Smoke Grenade.

[Aerozord]

forgot this has multiplayer, anyone interested in trying some multiplayer?

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Basically, I play XCOM too much as an RPG and not enough as a strategy game.

Pretty much this. Even with the difficulty modes enemy unknown was still comparatively easy to the days I cut my teeth on terror from the deep. Widely considered the hardest xcom in the entire series. Carried over strats from that one to enemy unknown and wrecked everything. Typically only lose soldiers way late into the game.

Aggressive flush n fire buddy system. Never disappoints.

[Aerozord]

I'm more a suppressive fire and shotgun to the face. As you guys might remember from my livestream.

Though late game I stealth scouts and use my snipers to pick off people across the map
Also true. Just their ability to destroy cover without using some once-a-mission thing makes them enormously valuable

I think that was changed, I was just doing a mission where I blew up fragile walls with simple gunfire like I've seen the aliens do

[Loyal]

Weapons fire will sometimes destroy cover, but MECs get the Collateral Damage ability at Squaddie level to do light AOE damage vaporize all destructible cover in the affected area. Costs 2.5 ammo. MECs can also optionally gain the Kinetic Strike Module, allowing you to unleash your inner Koolaid Man with giant powered fists.

[Aerozord]

I forgot how much I hate enemies getting that free movement when they are spotted. If your last guy spots them you are basically screwed because they can completely flank you with a free extra move action.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

not too big an issue with overwatch, really. Unless it's absolutely required for imminent victory or to grab meld I tend to keep half the squad positioned in overwatch for the other half to flush the aliens out.

[Gregness]

I forgot how much I hate enemies getting that free movement when they are spotted. If your last guy spots them you are basically screwed because they can completely flank you with a free extra move action.

This happens when you activate an alien pod on your lost move of the turn. The solution is to move in such a way that if you do activate, it's on your first move. Have your first couple moves of the turn be the furthest out in the direction you're moving, that way whatever else happens in the turn, the aliens won't be able to just activate and flank you.

[Loyal]

In addition, it's also possible to take advantage of this if you know where the enemy is, either through liberal application of Battle Scanners or just good gamesense. When a pod first activates, they'll run away from whoever activated them in the direction of some cover that will protect them from that person. If you have someone hiding within walking distance of a flank, you can then have them come out and take easy shots.

Doors are also helpful for this since they block line of sight until opened, but won't stop you from moving through them when you want to. It's easy to use them to set up ambushes. Let me show you how I cleared a landed Abductor recently, for instance.

http://i.imgur.com/IiTPCoU.png
The pod with Outsiders/Sectoid Cmdrs/Ethereals is in the bridge, and they'll hole themselves up in there, so I don't need a battle scanner to know where they are. I've positioned most of my forces just outside the main door and sent my MEC Trooper to the side to blow in the wall. She does so, and then runs inside. Since this activates the pod, they all run to take position and hide from her. But, since she's in the middle of the bridge, they instead run...

http://i.imgur.com/et41fbR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RhVoPyZ.jpg
...right up and out the door. Into the waiting arms of the ambush they didn't know was there, all with loaded guns and full AP.

tl;dr: Take advantage of line of sight (or lack thereof) to set up ambushes. Doors and high cover are your friend here. Explosives (and giant fists) are just as useful for creating ambushes, via newly-exposed line of sight, as they are for directly doing damage.

----

Also, we have some additional details on XCOM2's Ranger class. (http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/06/09/meet-the-xcom-2-ranger-ign-first?watch)

[Aerozord]

I know how to deal with it, its that I hate that I have to deal with it. Why is my enemy being rewarded for me locating them?

Ok I know why, its because if they didn't they'd get steamrolled. Still there has to be a better game design solution, like they cant move next turn or when discovered they get a defensive buff or maybe the unit that located them gets a free extra move. It should be rewarding me for locating my targets not punishing me for it.

[MasterOfMagic]

Best solution would be to have them actually patrol, hopping through cover. The way they just randomly spawn is broken anyways.

They managed to keep it interesting in spite of it, but that's one of the things I'm hopeful for in the new one.

Oh and I'M SO VERY EXCITED OMG OMG

[Aerozord]

Best solution would be to have them actually patrol, hopping through cover. The way they just randomly spawn is broken anyways.

Thing is they do that on terror missions. So they are capable

[Arcanum]

Best solution would be to have them actually patrol, hopping through cover. The way they just randomly spawn is broken anyways.

They managed to keep it interesting in spite of it, but that's one of the things I'm hopeful for in the new one.

Oh and I'M SO VERY EXCITED OMG OMG

They do patrol though. The problem is that when they are in the fog of war they took a shortcut of instantly moving them to their next location if that location also happens to be in the fog of war. If their next location is in your field of vision then they will patrol into you and then scamper.

Well that's how it works in theory, because they managed to screw something up and sometimes a pod will teleport to their next location that happens to be in your field of view, making it seem like the aliens randomly spawned in the middle of your squad.

Dunno if they fixed the bug since the last time I played, but I had that happen to me a few times near launch.

[MasterOfMagic]

Yeah, they fixed that. Only ones that do that now are the rocket guys, but that's the point of them, so.

The terror missions are a bit different, since there are civilians to kill. And even then the ai messes up quite a bit. I think they could have done real patrols, but did a cost savings thing. Hopefully they will avoid that in the new one after all the issues they had.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

So, it's due to be released in November and why it is PC exclusive (http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/06/05/why-xcom-2-had-to-be-pc-exclusive).

[Gregness]

So, Firaxis released the raw demo footage they showed at E3

Ok65u-2DoVw

Really excited for the enhanced customization features (accents, mostly).