Premmy's Big-Long Anti-Racism thread.

[Geminex]

I agree with Smarty on the genism bit. You can modify a person's genotype, theoretically anyway. What you can't do, is control the factors that influence the phenotype. And they have so much more influence on a person's... identity, really, than the genes. Sure, you can eliminate certain genetic diseases through genetic modification. And perhaps you can even modify some physical traits, though the interaction of various transcribed proteins are so complex, you'd need one hell of a research budget to manage this. But an individual's behavior, how they will act, who they are, that, I believe, lies in the phenotype.

Edit:

Though I would be interested in some more info on the affirmative-action plans and the ineffectiveness thereof, that smarty mentioned.

[CABAL49]

Since I actually spend a lot of time helping immigrants learn English, avoiding "people of color" is not an option. But I am reminded of a remark someone made, saying I didn't have many white friends. I wonder if that means I subconsciously discriminate against white people...

[DFM]

Originally Posted by krogothwolf

I don't really think white people rule the world anymore.

Hahahahahahaha

[Odjn]

Originally Posted by krogothwolf

I don't really think white people rule the world anymore Prem. You could have said America and be more truthful, but the world? Not only that, American culture seems like a mash of others with the US adding its own flavour to it.
.

Fuck you kroggy I spit-taked milk all over my laptop when I read this.

[krogothwolf]

Originally Posted by Odjn

Fuck you kroggy I spit-taked milk all over my laptop when I read this.

Hey, All I know is half the companies I've worked for are now run by rich people from china or japan. It makes me wonder.

[DFM]

Actually companies from China and Japan take up number Nine and Number Ten, respectively, on the top ten of the Global 500 list of most powerful/successful companies. Eight through One are Old Rich White people. I think they're all American's, too.

One of them might be French.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Originally Posted by Lev

{{citation needed}}

What bit would you like me to cite? Cause every study ever done in the last 40 years on the influence of environment versus genes overwhelmingly concludes that environment is far more critical than genetic upbringing.
The simplest way to look at it is that the brain- our most critical part- is barely developed when you are born the first years of life are when it develops ad that development is pretty much entirely environmental determined.
And then there is the fact that genes react different to different environments. There is no one simple gene that always does one thing- the body is a complex set of interactions which depend on so many more things than genetic interactions.
Even at its absolute most basic level the tertiary structure of a gene is determined by environmental factors- if you change these factors you change the final behaviour.
If you want me to cite a specific thing I can but just go to google- this is simple basic stuff, first year biology.
I'm pretty sure I cited a whole lot of stuff the last time you made this ridiculous argument- so you can go back and read that one.

And changing society is far cheaper than molecular cells- or do you wat me to cite that too.

Originally Posted by POS Industries

I'm curious as to what degree you differentiate between class-based oppression and race-based oppression in America, as it strikes me that more and more in our current era that the major contributing factor to the impediment of the upward mobility of the average African-American is that we live in a society set up to favor the rich and to maintain that the wealthier citizens not only remain as such but further gain more wealth, which necessitates keeping money, resources, and opportunities for advancement out of the hands of the poor lest we risk any sort of redistribution of wealth to even the most minor degree.

Naturally, the fact that a large share of the black community finds themselves being the victims of what is distinctly class-based warfare--whether those winning the war realize this or not--is certainly based in the centuries of racial oppression they've undergone, and there is certainly a persistent stigma in regards to race relations in this country, but to say that, for the most part, the struggle of the average poor black American is different from the struggle of the average poor white American has quickly become increasingly inaccurate.

In fact, I would say that the racist element is less that black people are not advancing because they're black but the fact that a number of (dumber) white people are under the impression that the reason most black people who do advance in some financial respect do so because whatever white person that surely had to hire them/promote them/enroll them only did so because they were afraid they'd be labeled racist if they did not. This is, of course, ludicrous and obviously a pathetic attempt by dumbass white folks to claim that they are now the ones experiencing racial oppression, because I guess they think that's how you get handed things nowadays. The idea that a black man could possibly be the most qualified candidate eludes them.

However, the people in America who think this way typically don't appear to be the ones in power. In fact, the larger share of them seem to be living in poverty themselves, and are simply angry and looking for someone to blame for their own victimization at the hands of our socioeconomic system without wanting to abandon the system themselves, lest they dash their hopes of somehow being on the top of it themselves one day.

This is pretty much a better version of my argument and I think it is really the most compelling argument that you have to make.

Originally Posted by Geminex

Edit:

Though I would be interested in some more info on the affirmative-action plans and the ineffectiveness thereof, that smarty mentioned.

As I said, my info is based not on the US but on NZ- I can get you some data on that if necessary- but I have no idea how relevant it is. It would seem likely that the same principals apply though.

[Ecks]

Originally Posted by krogothwolf

Hey, All I know is half the companies I've worked for are now run by rich people from china or japan. It makes me wonder.

It's because the rich people from America sold out to those rich people from China and Japan. It is the biggest expression of PIGGY PIGGY PIGGY FUCK PIGGY PIGGYextreme fucking greed since the Enron or Delphia scandals. Instead of embezzling money, now they sell out to foreign countries through actual sale or through outsourcing.

So that they can afford to buy themselves twenty cars, five homes, personal golf courses and amusement parks... but not personal ball washers, strangely enough.

[krogothwolf]

Originally Posted by DFM

One of them might be French.

Damn french people!

Plus in terms of population, Asia has 60% of the world population and I'm fairly sure they are predominantly not white. White's are probably just more greedy then everyone else.

[Funka Genocide]

Racism is propogated by ignorance, ignorance is a byproduct of insufficient education, insufficient education is a product of being poor.

Basically, I feel that racism is something only poor people espouse or deal with regularly, minus the few wacky old rich coots.

The problem with American society isn't really racism as it is distinction of class and a lack of opportunity for the underpriviliged. I've personally never had to deal with any serious form of racism (denial of services, job related harassment etc. etc.) and I am a minority. I've never used any form of affirmative action nor have I ever applied for a job as a minority applicant, and I always get hired due to my qualifications. All this coupled with the fact that my family is poor as fuck lead me to believe that anyone who plays the race card as an explanation as to why their life sucks is probably delusional. I've seen many success stories from people who came to America barely able to speak english, and through hard work and perseverence managed to build a happy and successful life. I'm not saying it's an easy thing to raise one' self out of poverty, but honestly the color of your skin is not going to stop you.

Of course everyone (yes everyone, even white people) has to deal with some form of racism in their life. But for the most part these are relegated to off color comments or insults. Whoopty fuckin' do. I don't do it, you probably don't do it, some people do do it. I think this is the point you were trying to make about "some people are dicks" but honestly, that's the worst you should have to deal with in life. (barring some psychopath or something.)

A few minor cultural quirks aside (do you use tortillas or wonderbread? who the fuck cares?) race means pretty much nothing to most successful americans, all that matters is the all mighty dollar. So if I were you, I'd start worrying about the real problem, which is endemic ignorance of various American subcultures and the redistribution of financial resources for the elevation of the downtrodden masses (who aren't just black.)

As for everyone is racist, I suppose there's some truth to that. Maybe it's not necessarily racism as culture based discrimination though. For example, I had to catch myself the other day as I went on a tirade against "beer swilling rednecks." That's really fucking racist. My views have gotten to the point where I consider such inoccuous activities as enjoying NASCAR or recreational hunting to be condemning activities. It's really easy to go off the deep end with stuff like this, and while my views are derived not from the color of people's skins but from their ways of life, they're still unfair and judgmental.

I think this is a good, thought provoking topic, maybe something educational will arise from it.