Steve Jobs has died.

[Aerozord]

Originally Posted by Sifright

Never bought a single apple product.

good man

Originally Posted by Sifright

Also, It would be as much of an issue if tech goods didn't have +300% markup on their goods.

They are economies of scale, there is actually a valid reason for this. Tech industry has very high development costs but low manufacturing costs. They rely on that large profit margin to make up for the initial investment. Though Macs I know do overcharge by alot. Not so sure about iPod.

Originally Posted by Karesh

Nobody has to step over to China and physically force every company to stop these practices, they just need to stop using the production companies that are using those practices.

I know its nuanced but China is communist nation. The production company is China itself. You wont get better anywhere else. Unless you mean the manufacturer that outsources it to begin with, but then you are back to the "they aren't actually there" issue.

Now if you mean stop outsourcing to third world nations period. I do agree that would do it, but as I said before US citizen would rather have cheap goods made by slave labor, then expensive goods made by morally upright companies.

[Sifright]

Alot of the apple products are mostly cheap systems on a chip designs, as expense go there isn't all that much to the development costs, bare in mind they aren't doing shit like intel or amd which truly is expensive as they pioneering new manufactuing process for increasingly harder to get working size reductions. I imagine most of their budget for these goods is blown on marketing.

[Karrrrrrrrrrrresche]

Originally Posted by Aerozord

I know its nuanced but China is communist nation.

Hah.
Haaaaaaaah.
The Chinese Government hasn't owned the means of production since... like, the 1980s or late 70s.

[Aerozord]

Originally Posted by Sifright

Alot of the apple products are mostly cheap systems on a chip designs, as expense go there isn't all that much to the development costs, bare in mind they aren't doing shit like intel or amd which truly is expensive as they pioneering new manufactuing process for increasingly harder to get working size reductions. I imagine most of their budget for these goods is blown on marketing.

I was talking about tech over all. I do not have the information to know if what you say is accurate or not, but it would not surprise me. Though to be fair apple did get some awesome marketing for the iPod. At this point now its kind of unneeded. iPod and its derivatives are simply the name brand now.

Hard to say how justified all of their cost is. But fact of the matter is if they stopped manufacturing this way they'd lose alot of money. Frankly they have no motivation to change. In fact under US law if Apple made such a move its shareholders have the right to sue Apple because a corporation is legally required to do all it can to maximize profits.

Only way Apple will stop doing this, is if enough people stop buying their products under protest of their immoral actions to make it the smarter move to stop using slave labor

[Marc v4.0]

Christ.

Start another damn thread or something, have and show a little decency.

[Karrrrrrrrrrrresche]

Originally Posted by Marc v1.0

Christ.

Start another damn thread or something, have and show a little decency.

What exactly would we call that thread?
"The thread where people that like Apple shouldn't go because we're going to be talking about how many people live and die in deplorable conditions as a direct result of their business practices" ?

I mean by decency what you really mean is respect for the dead. But just because Steve Jobs made great phones and might not have been directly responsible for these deaths doesn't really mean that we should forget he ever had a part in it. Rather, I think that's an even greater show of disrespect to the multitude of lives lost. That you feel discussing their deplorable conditions and continuing suffering is somehow an insult to a dead man who, while I don't believe was ever fully responsible, could have damn sure easily done more to prevent it.

Edit: Besides which I'm pretty sure somebody said Apple criticism was okay as long as we weren't dancing for joy over his grave. Which I'm not. It's sad to see him go, but that's not going to prevent me from acknowledging that not all the man did was good.

[TDK]

Is expressing an opinion bad now?

I genuinely don't understand what rule I was violating by implying I was glad he's dead. Though it is very possible I need to reread the rules. I've been going on "don't be an asshole to any forumites, spam, etc." for a while.

Side note: I'm not like jumping for joy, the dance emote was hyperbole. I don't really care that he's dead. I was just indicating that I think he was a terrible person. Bad person being dead is generally considered a good thing, is it not? Hitler, Hussein, Osama, etc? Perhaps in poor taste, but I wasn't aware poor taste was against the rules.


On topic: I think not doing everything in his power to stop the use of slave labor by HIS company makes Steve Jobs morally reprehensible, yes. On an unrelated note, Apple's products are overpriced bullshit.

Edit for below: What, we should be Super Nice to someone just because they died? Dying doesn't make you not a dick.

[Fifthfiend]

Originally Posted by Karesh

I mean by decency what you really mean is respect for the dead.

and that would just be awful

NPF: We Literally Cannot Comprehend The Difference Between Criticizing Someone And Criticizing Someone The Day After Their Death In A Conversation Regarding Their Death.

Originally Posted by TDK

So what if I said I'm glad Hitler was dead

NPF: We Literally Cannot Comprehend The Difference Between Steve Jobs and Hitler.

[TDK]

Because killing horribly (or allowing to be killed horribly by YOUR COMPANY) thousands of people makes you a much better person than if it is millions. Disregard for human life is disregard for human life.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Well to be fair, I don't understand the whole "respect for the dead" shit. They're dead, they don't give a shit.
Like you could possiby do it out of respect of their relatives but I'm pretty sure Steve Job's wife isn't in here.

But I mean dying doesn't get you a super special magical pass out of criticism.
And like yeah this perhaps isn't the best thread but if you're talking about Job's legacy inhis death thread you have to bring up both the bad and the good. If you're going to bring up the good, you gotta mentio the bad.